Hello,
I just bought a new laptop and want to run soft synths with sequences for live performance using my XP-80 as a controller. I have a few soft synth programs but don't know what hosting programs or sequencing software will work together. Would a hosting program with sequencing ability be best ideally? I prefer to have the laptop run the sequence and not the XP-80.
I'm completely new to this and am fairly sure something decent could be set up with the Dell laptop.
Also, the laptop is brand new and I'm undecided (after reading some posts about recommended laptops) if it's the best choice for what I want to do.
The Laptop:
Model: Latitude D820
Intel Core 2 Duo T7200, 2.00GHz, 667Mhz 4M L2 Cache
2.0GB, DDR2-667 SDRAM
15.4 inch Wide Screen WSXGA+
100GB SATA Hard Drive 7200RPM
Swappable optical drive bay (for back up HDD)
The CD/DVD burner is only 8X but I can live with the speed for now....
The laptops sound isn't that great (integrated), but I have an M-Audio Mobile Pre USB that I plan to use. Any input would be greatly appreciated as I've been wanting this sort of set up for a long time and as far as the laptop, have to make a yay or nay on it pretty soon!
Thanks!
Hosting Programs and Accompanying Sequencers
-
citizenzero
- Posts: 12
- Joined: 15:51, 14 October 2006
-
SammyJames
- Posts: 1118
- Joined: 23:48, 18 April 2003
- Location: USA
- Contact:
Re: Hosting Programs and Accompanying Sequencers
Citizen:
I will be seconded, thirded, and fourthed by anyone else on this board who sees this message -- I would suggest that if you are considering selling your PC to buy something else, I would, and would get a MacBook or MacBook Pro. (If you are made of money, get the Pro. Otherwise, go with the MacBook.) Even a 2.0 GHz Macbook with the Core 2 Duo is a HUGE leap over the PC.
The other thing is that the soft synths will play in Cubase 4 easily. Cubase can act as the host for a number of plug-ins. I had to go through this my self about a year ago, so I'll explain in detail but as briefly as I can.
The way in which the soft synth thing works is as follows: You put the plug-in's .DLL (or in the case of a Mac, an AU file or AudioUnits file, or a .VST file, depending on the format that your sequencer is based on) into a folder. Then you tell your host sequencing program where the folder is, and it goes to that folder to load the synth into the program. From there, assuming that you have properly configured everything, the soft synth shows up in an instrument track as a pull-down menu within the sequencer.
It isn't that hard -- the toughest part is knowing where the sequencer will look for the synth files. (Use the Help or your manual to learn more about this.) Don't forget that the samples for sample-based soft synths need a folder as well -- but the AU or dll can exist separately from the samples. A lot of folks will organize their stuff differently; I myself like to keep all of the dll / AU stuff in one folder, and keep the samples in a different folder. But you need to figure out what works best for you.
Finally, the M-Audio piece is probably fine, although again, you might want to consider upgrading to a FireWire interface. Artemio will absolutely back me up on that one too.
Take care! Let me know if there is anything else that I can help you with on this. I like the idea a lot -- it just sounds like you need to do some tweaking to your setup, and you should be rollin'.
- Sammy
Sammy James has been approved for use by people who need approval.
http://www.sammyjames.com/music.htm
I will be seconded, thirded, and fourthed by anyone else on this board who sees this message -- I would suggest that if you are considering selling your PC to buy something else, I would, and would get a MacBook or MacBook Pro. (If you are made of money, get the Pro. Otherwise, go with the MacBook.) Even a 2.0 GHz Macbook with the Core 2 Duo is a HUGE leap over the PC.
The other thing is that the soft synths will play in Cubase 4 easily. Cubase can act as the host for a number of plug-ins. I had to go through this my self about a year ago, so I'll explain in detail but as briefly as I can.
The way in which the soft synth thing works is as follows: You put the plug-in's .DLL (or in the case of a Mac, an AU file or AudioUnits file, or a .VST file, depending on the format that your sequencer is based on) into a folder. Then you tell your host sequencing program where the folder is, and it goes to that folder to load the synth into the program. From there, assuming that you have properly configured everything, the soft synth shows up in an instrument track as a pull-down menu within the sequencer.
It isn't that hard -- the toughest part is knowing where the sequencer will look for the synth files. (Use the Help or your manual to learn more about this.) Don't forget that the samples for sample-based soft synths need a folder as well -- but the AU or dll can exist separately from the samples. A lot of folks will organize their stuff differently; I myself like to keep all of the dll / AU stuff in one folder, and keep the samples in a different folder. But you need to figure out what works best for you.
Finally, the M-Audio piece is probably fine, although again, you might want to consider upgrading to a FireWire interface. Artemio will absolutely back me up on that one too.
Take care! Let me know if there is anything else that I can help you with on this. I like the idea a lot -- it just sounds like you need to do some tweaking to your setup, and you should be rollin'.
- Sammy
Sammy James has been approved for use by people who need approval.
http://www.sammyjames.com/music.htm
-
citizenzero
- Posts: 12
- Joined: 15:51, 14 October 2006
Thanks Sammy!
Sammy,
Actually I just bought the Dell latitude D820. I had thought about returning it and going for another system, but I was too late making that decision and now it's mine, basically...
Clearly, you prefer a MAC over a PC. Are PC's problematic in your opinion? A friend of mine has a Dell Inspiron 9100 and runs soft synths using Brainspawn forte and an M-Audio Fast Track Pro (basically not much different than my Mobile Pre, both are USB 1.1), and he doesn't have any problems, then again his computer doesn't have a Core 2 Duo processor like mine and he doesn't run sequences, just uses the synths for live performance sounds.
I really need alot of direction with this because I'm brand new to it and don't know what works with what yet, etc.
I'm thinking of using Cakewalk SONAR for the hosting/sequencing (I want to upgrade my recording software anyway because I have Calewalk Home Studio now), and then I've heard that Ableton Live is really good too, though it's quite expensive....
Basically, I need a hosting program and sequencer (rolled into one would be ideal) that 's really robust and can allow me to also play live parts through the soft synths and control functions like stop/start of the sequencer from my keyboard pedals, etc.
Seems like I'm asking for alot, but I know that it's possible, just don't know how it's all done and the best way to go yet....
Paul
Actually I just bought the Dell latitude D820. I had thought about returning it and going for another system, but I was too late making that decision and now it's mine, basically...
Clearly, you prefer a MAC over a PC. Are PC's problematic in your opinion? A friend of mine has a Dell Inspiron 9100 and runs soft synths using Brainspawn forte and an M-Audio Fast Track Pro (basically not much different than my Mobile Pre, both are USB 1.1), and he doesn't have any problems, then again his computer doesn't have a Core 2 Duo processor like mine and he doesn't run sequences, just uses the synths for live performance sounds.
I really need alot of direction with this because I'm brand new to it and don't know what works with what yet, etc.
I'm thinking of using Cakewalk SONAR for the hosting/sequencing (I want to upgrade my recording software anyway because I have Calewalk Home Studio now), and then I've heard that Ableton Live is really good too, though it's quite expensive....
Basically, I need a hosting program and sequencer (rolled into one would be ideal) that 's really robust and can allow me to also play live parts through the soft synths and control functions like stop/start of the sequencer from my keyboard pedals, etc.
Seems like I'm asking for alot, but I know that it's possible, just don't know how it's all done and the best way to go yet....
Paul
-
SammyJames
- Posts: 1118
- Joined: 23:48, 18 April 2003
- Location: USA
- Contact:
Re: Hosting Programs and Accompanying Sequencers
Paul:
Oh, don't worry too much. I completely understand your predicament, and I'm not slamming PCs. I am a VERY recent convert back to Macs, after years of believing that there wasn't much difference between the Mac and the PC. Basically, for years, PCs had an edge, which was that they had the Intel / AMD processors, and Macs ran on Motorola chipsets that weren't up to snuff. That has changed now, because Macs are every BIT as powerful as PCs, and are better-suited to music, because they are built on a Unix-based system.
Anyway, back to the PC. I think that the model that you own will be just fine. The one thing that I would suggest is that you do go with FireWire, and you can do this because your PC does have one FireWire port. (Just check to make sure that it is SIX pin, and not FOUR... if it is the latter, then you will have to power the interface using a wall-wart. The Six-pin variety of FW products lets you power the unit from your computer, which is really nice.) Artemio gave me a good idea of USB versus FireWire, and if you have any more questions about the differences, contact him. He will absolutely defend my position on this, and he will probably have a good suggestion on which FW interface to buy (assuming that you haven't already done so).
I just went back and reread your post. As far as good programs go, I would recommend Cubase. Sonar is good, and it is made in the good-old USA. I'm biased against them, because I used to work at Cakewalk, and it is personal for me. But I do think that Cubase is a superior program. You don't get some of the things that Sonar gives you (at least at the Sonar pro level) such as with the pitch correction and so on. But the fact is that Cubase is a dual-platform program, so it will run on Macs too. And this could come in handy if you want to take your projects to other studios or to your friend's house, or anywhere else for that matter. Sonar is still a one-platform product, something that baffles me to this day.
Finally, the most important things for you to do with the PC are as follows:
1. Go to Properties on the Desktop, and make the following changes:
- Turn the Desktop Image off, and choose a color for the Desktop background.
- Go to the "Hibernate" tab, and make sure that Hibernation is OFF.
- Turn the screensaver off (just to avoid surprising yourself if you are in the middle of recording Proust, and you forget to move the mouse in the middle of it...)
- Goto "Power Schemes," and turn off anything that will stop your hard drives, monitor, or system in the middle of a project.
2. Go to the Control Panel. Go to "Sounds and Audio Devices." Click on "Sounds," and choose "No Sounds" as your Sound scheme. Next, go to "Audio" and make sure that the audio interface that you are using is selected in "Sound playback," "Sound recording," and "MIDI music playback."
3. Stay in Control Panel. Next, go to "System Properties." Click on "Advanced," then click on "Performance > Settings" and look at "Visual Effects." Select the radio button for "Adjust for best performance." You may check one or two of the options if you need something specific (like screen font smoothing or whatever). Just remember that the graphics card will eat up processing power, so it is a good idea to defeat as many of these options as you can get away with.
Once you click Apply, click on "Advanced" (which is the next tab, right after Visual Effects). Believe it or not, you should change the Processor Scheduling to "Background Processes." I believe that this has something to do with the way in which the processor deals with memory or some such thing. I believe also that a lot of PC gamers set this option the same way, because for some reason it does improve the overal system performance.
If you want to ensure that your system is running as efficiently as possible, these are all great steps to take. I have no idea if you already knew all of this stuff; if so, then tell me and I'll shut up! But if not, let me know and I will give you one more set of things to do to optimize your computer for music.
Take care. I hope that this is helpful.
- Sammy
Sammy James has been approved for use by people who need approval.
http://www.sammyjames.com/music.htm
Oh, don't worry too much. I completely understand your predicament, and I'm not slamming PCs. I am a VERY recent convert back to Macs, after years of believing that there wasn't much difference between the Mac and the PC. Basically, for years, PCs had an edge, which was that they had the Intel / AMD processors, and Macs ran on Motorola chipsets that weren't up to snuff. That has changed now, because Macs are every BIT as powerful as PCs, and are better-suited to music, because they are built on a Unix-based system.
Anyway, back to the PC. I think that the model that you own will be just fine. The one thing that I would suggest is that you do go with FireWire, and you can do this because your PC does have one FireWire port. (Just check to make sure that it is SIX pin, and not FOUR... if it is the latter, then you will have to power the interface using a wall-wart. The Six-pin variety of FW products lets you power the unit from your computer, which is really nice.) Artemio gave me a good idea of USB versus FireWire, and if you have any more questions about the differences, contact him. He will absolutely defend my position on this, and he will probably have a good suggestion on which FW interface to buy (assuming that you haven't already done so).
I just went back and reread your post. As far as good programs go, I would recommend Cubase. Sonar is good, and it is made in the good-old USA. I'm biased against them, because I used to work at Cakewalk, and it is personal for me. But I do think that Cubase is a superior program. You don't get some of the things that Sonar gives you (at least at the Sonar pro level) such as with the pitch correction and so on. But the fact is that Cubase is a dual-platform program, so it will run on Macs too. And this could come in handy if you want to take your projects to other studios or to your friend's house, or anywhere else for that matter. Sonar is still a one-platform product, something that baffles me to this day.
Finally, the most important things for you to do with the PC are as follows:
1. Go to Properties on the Desktop, and make the following changes:
- Turn the Desktop Image off, and choose a color for the Desktop background.
- Go to the "Hibernate" tab, and make sure that Hibernation is OFF.
- Turn the screensaver off (just to avoid surprising yourself if you are in the middle of recording Proust, and you forget to move the mouse in the middle of it...)
- Goto "Power Schemes," and turn off anything that will stop your hard drives, monitor, or system in the middle of a project.
2. Go to the Control Panel. Go to "Sounds and Audio Devices." Click on "Sounds," and choose "No Sounds" as your Sound scheme. Next, go to "Audio" and make sure that the audio interface that you are using is selected in "Sound playback," "Sound recording," and "MIDI music playback."
3. Stay in Control Panel. Next, go to "System Properties." Click on "Advanced," then click on "Performance > Settings" and look at "Visual Effects." Select the radio button for "Adjust for best performance." You may check one or two of the options if you need something specific (like screen font smoothing or whatever). Just remember that the graphics card will eat up processing power, so it is a good idea to defeat as many of these options as you can get away with.
Once you click Apply, click on "Advanced" (which is the next tab, right after Visual Effects). Believe it or not, you should change the Processor Scheduling to "Background Processes." I believe that this has something to do with the way in which the processor deals with memory or some such thing. I believe also that a lot of PC gamers set this option the same way, because for some reason it does improve the overal system performance.
If you want to ensure that your system is running as efficiently as possible, these are all great steps to take. I have no idea if you already knew all of this stuff; if so, then tell me and I'll shut up! But if not, let me know and I will give you one more set of things to do to optimize your computer for music.
Take care. I hope that this is helpful.
- Sammy
Sammy James has been approved for use by people who need approval.
http://www.sammyjames.com/music.htm
-
citizenzero
- Posts: 12
- Joined: 15:51, 14 October 2006
SONAR vs. Cubase
Sammy,
Thanks for all the suggestions for optimization. Some of them I was aware of, but I know there are many things that you can adjust, shut off, etc., that I don't know about.
I found a site called xpmusic.net and they have all the same recommendations you've mentioned, if there are others outside of the list they provide which you've found in your experience with PC based music, please let me know. I went back to the site to copy the list for you but that page on the site was unavailable. Here's the link: http://www.musicxp.net
The list is under "Tuning Tips"....
Unfortunately, the Mobile Pre USB is not all that old, I wished I'd known more about it at the time because the salesperson did offer me the Firewire version, and having only my desktop at the time which only had USB ports, I went with what was easiest. Now in retrospect, knowing a little more about the difference between the two, I realize it was a very ill-informed decision on my part. Not to say that the soundcard I have is bad, but I agree that Firewire would have an easier time handling the data with a 388MB leap on the USB 1.1!
I'm sorry that your experience at Cakewalk wasn't positive, though I'll probably go with upgrading to Sonar because at this point after buying this laptop, basically I'm broke....lol....and already having Home Studio, the upgrades are the cheapest way to go.
A few things I'd really like to know, having worked on the inside:
Is Sonar robust enough to host soft synths like Mtron, TimeWarp ARP 2600, Kontakt Done, etc. while running a sequence and allowing me to add live parts through one of the plug-ins, in addition to controlling functions of the sequencer in Sonar like stop/start, program change, etc. from an external source such as a foot pedal?
What version of Sonar would you recommend that won't be too rough on the wallet, yet still be robust enough to handle what I want to do?
I hope my questions aren't too much, most of this stuff is a huge learning curve for me!
Regards,
Paul
Thanks for all the suggestions for optimization. Some of them I was aware of, but I know there are many things that you can adjust, shut off, etc., that I don't know about.
I found a site called xpmusic.net and they have all the same recommendations you've mentioned, if there are others outside of the list they provide which you've found in your experience with PC based music, please let me know. I went back to the site to copy the list for you but that page on the site was unavailable. Here's the link: http://www.musicxp.net
The list is under "Tuning Tips"....
Unfortunately, the Mobile Pre USB is not all that old, I wished I'd known more about it at the time because the salesperson did offer me the Firewire version, and having only my desktop at the time which only had USB ports, I went with what was easiest. Now in retrospect, knowing a little more about the difference between the two, I realize it was a very ill-informed decision on my part. Not to say that the soundcard I have is bad, but I agree that Firewire would have an easier time handling the data with a 388MB leap on the USB 1.1!
I'm sorry that your experience at Cakewalk wasn't positive, though I'll probably go with upgrading to Sonar because at this point after buying this laptop, basically I'm broke....lol....and already having Home Studio, the upgrades are the cheapest way to go.
A few things I'd really like to know, having worked on the inside:
Is Sonar robust enough to host soft synths like Mtron, TimeWarp ARP 2600, Kontakt Done, etc. while running a sequence and allowing me to add live parts through one of the plug-ins, in addition to controlling functions of the sequencer in Sonar like stop/start, program change, etc. from an external source such as a foot pedal?
What version of Sonar would you recommend that won't be too rough on the wallet, yet still be robust enough to handle what I want to do?
I hope my questions aren't too much, most of this stuff is a huge learning curve for me!
Regards,
Paul
-
SammyJames
- Posts: 1118
- Joined: 23:48, 18 April 2003
- Location: USA
- Contact:
Re: Hosting Programs and Accompanying Sequencers
Paul:
SONAR vs. Cubase
>> Here's the link: http://www.musicxp.net The list is under "Tuning Tips"....
Yep. That is the site. I had been under the impression that this web site had gone under, but apparently it is still around. That is exactly where I got my information from -- albeit from memory...
>> I'm sorry that your experience at Cakewalk wasn't positive, though I'll probably go with upgrading to Sonar because at this point after buying this laptop, basically I'm broke....lol....and already having Home Studio, the upgrades are the cheapest way to go.
You can buy Sonar Home Studio 6 XL for $159.95. It doesn't get a lot cheaper than that.
>> A few things I'd really like to know, having worked on the inside: Is Sonar robust enough to host soft synths like Mtron, TimeWarp ARP 2600, Kontakt Done, etc. while running a sequence and allowing me to add live parts through one of the plug-ins, in addition to controlling functions of the sequencer in Sonar like stop/start, program change, etc. from an external source such as a foot pedal?
Well, as they always say -- it depends on your computer. Your PC SHOULD be able to handle what you suggested... but "should" and "does" are sometimes miles apart.
>> What version of Sonar would you recommend that won't be too rough on the wallet, yet still be robust enough to handle what I want to do?
It really isn't so much the version of Sonar. The basic program is the same exact version, albeit with some omissions. You might not get the razzle-dazzle effects with the less-expensive versions, but they haven't really optimized the program to run on your computer any more with the more expensive versions. At least, I sure don't THINK so. If they have done this, then the only way to find out is to contact Cakewalk -- and ask them.
Some companies will release a "lite" version of their software that isn't based on the same technology. This was true, for instance, with Cubase LE and SE. Anyone who runs one of these programs knows that the older Cubase technology is incomparable to SX 3, and the newest, Cubase 4. I sure learned this when I loaded Cubase 4 in for the first time, and actually got MUCH better performance from my PC.
At the end of it all, I would just try it. You have spent a ton of money already, so spending a bit more is actually a good idea -- to ensure that your initial investment is sound. Assuming that you can get some music done with your current configuration, you'll be well on your way to getting a better overall system next time around. And if it DOESN'T work how you expected, then you will have only spent a little bit more to find this out. If that happens, sell it all and start over.
That is what I have done. And now I need to sit down and make some darned music for a change.
- Sammy
Sammy James has been approved for use by people who need approval.
http://www.sammyjames.com/music.htm
SONAR vs. Cubase
>> Here's the link: http://www.musicxp.net The list is under "Tuning Tips"....
Yep. That is the site. I had been under the impression that this web site had gone under, but apparently it is still around. That is exactly where I got my information from -- albeit from memory...
>> I'm sorry that your experience at Cakewalk wasn't positive, though I'll probably go with upgrading to Sonar because at this point after buying this laptop, basically I'm broke....lol....and already having Home Studio, the upgrades are the cheapest way to go.
You can buy Sonar Home Studio 6 XL for $159.95. It doesn't get a lot cheaper than that.
>> A few things I'd really like to know, having worked on the inside: Is Sonar robust enough to host soft synths like Mtron, TimeWarp ARP 2600, Kontakt Done, etc. while running a sequence and allowing me to add live parts through one of the plug-ins, in addition to controlling functions of the sequencer in Sonar like stop/start, program change, etc. from an external source such as a foot pedal?
Well, as they always say -- it depends on your computer. Your PC SHOULD be able to handle what you suggested... but "should" and "does" are sometimes miles apart.
>> What version of Sonar would you recommend that won't be too rough on the wallet, yet still be robust enough to handle what I want to do?
It really isn't so much the version of Sonar. The basic program is the same exact version, albeit with some omissions. You might not get the razzle-dazzle effects with the less-expensive versions, but they haven't really optimized the program to run on your computer any more with the more expensive versions. At least, I sure don't THINK so. If they have done this, then the only way to find out is to contact Cakewalk -- and ask them.
Some companies will release a "lite" version of their software that isn't based on the same technology. This was true, for instance, with Cubase LE and SE. Anyone who runs one of these programs knows that the older Cubase technology is incomparable to SX 3, and the newest, Cubase 4. I sure learned this when I loaded Cubase 4 in for the first time, and actually got MUCH better performance from my PC.
At the end of it all, I would just try it. You have spent a ton of money already, so spending a bit more is actually a good idea -- to ensure that your initial investment is sound. Assuming that you can get some music done with your current configuration, you'll be well on your way to getting a better overall system next time around. And if it DOESN'T work how you expected, then you will have only spent a little bit more to find this out. If that happens, sell it all and start over.
That is what I have done. And now I need to sit down and make some darned music for a change.
- Sammy
Sammy James has been approved for use by people who need approval.
http://www.sammyjames.com/music.htm
Re: Hosting Programs and Accompanying Sequencers
Hey my very first comment on your site. ,I have been reading your post for a while and thought I would completely pop in and drop a friendly note. . It is great stuff indeed.
Laptop Screen Repairs
Laptop Screen Repairs