NEW FANTOM-G, PLEASE TALK HERE

[V-CeeOh]

Hi Everybody
In order to keep things organized, like we all like, I decided to start this new thread and concentrate all the available info. I'm also making it sticky for a while

Keep in mind that this thread is for FANTOM-G ONLY . Please post all other subjects and comments in the right sections.

The specs are the the same for all the 3 models except for keyboard size, overall size and weight.
These ones are for Fantom-G8

Keyboard and Sound Generator Section
Keyboard : 88 keys, PHA II, Ivory feel, with velocity and channel aftertouch
Mamimum Polyphony:128 voices, shared with the sampling section
Parts: 16 parts (Internal) + 16 parts (External) + 2 parts (ARX)+ 24 parts (Audio Track)
Wave Memory: 256MB (16-bit linear equivalent)
Waveforms: 2,153
Preset Memory:Patches 1,500 + 256 (GM2), Rhythm Sets 64 + 9 (GM2), Live Sets 512, Studio Sets 128
User Memory per one project: Patches 512, Rhythm Sets 64, Live Sets 512, Studio Sets 128
Effects: Patch Multi-Effects (PFX) 16 systems, 76 types, Multi-Effects (MFX) 2 systems, 78 types, Chorus 1 system, 3 types, Reverb 1 system, 10 types, Input Effects 1 system, 6 types, Mastering Effects 1 system, 3-band compressor
Data Format: 16-bit linear, .WAV or .AIFF
Sampling Frequency: 44.1kHz
Maximum Sampling Time: [When sampling memory isn't expanded (32MB)] mono: 360 sec. approx., stereo: 180 sec. approx. [When sampling memory is expanded with DIMM (544MB)] mono: 108 min. approx., stereo: 54 min. approx.
Number of Samples per one project: 2,000

Sequencer Section
Tracks: MIDI tracks (Internal/External/ARX): max. 128, Audio track: max. 24, Tempo track: 1, Beat track: 1
Resolution: 480 TPQN
Tempo: 5.00 to 300.00
Song per one project: 50
Phrase per one project: 2,000
Note Capacity per one project: approx. 1,000,000 notes
Song Length: 9,998 measures
Recording Method: Realtime recording, Step recording

Controllers
Pitch Bend/Modulation Lever, Control Knob x 4, Control Slider x 8, Assignable Switch x 2, D Beam Controller

Connectors
Headphones Jack, Stereo 1/4 inch phone type, A (MIX) Output Jacks (L/MONO, R), 1/4 inch TRS phone type, B Output Jacks (L, R), 1/4 inch phone type, Input Jacks (L/MONO/MIC, R), 1/4 inch phone type, Mic./Guitar Input Jacks, 1/4 inch phone type / XLR type (Phantom power)(Hi-Z), Pedal Jacks, Hold Pedal Jack (Half Pedal recognition), Control Pedal Jack, (assignable) x 2
MIDI Connectors: IN, OUT, THRU
USB Connectors: USB Computer Connector (supports file transfer or mass storage class, and Audio/MIDI), USB Mouse Connector
Digital Audio Interface: COAXIAL INPUT / OUTPUT
AC Inlet:

Others: Arpeggiator 128, Arpeggio Sets 128, RPS Sets 32, Rhythm Pattern Sets 32, Chord Memory 128, Chord Memory Sets 128

Display: Graphic Type, 8.5", Wide VGA (800 x 480 dots), backlit LCD (Color)

Pads: 16 pads, Velocity and Polyphonic Aftertouch sensitive

Expansion for sound generator: : ARX expansion boards: 2 slots

Expansion for sampling memory: : DIMM: 1 slot, supports PC133, CL=2/3, 3.3 V, 128MB, 256MB, 512MB

External Storage Device: USB Flash Memory

Power Supply: AC 117 V, AC 230 V, AC 240 V (50/60Hz), AC 220 V (60Hz)

Power Consumption: 30 W

Accessories: Owner's Manual, CD-ROM (Editor, USB MIDI driver), Power Cord

Options: Expansion Board: ARX Series, Keyboard Stand: KS-V7 (Fantom-G7/-G6), KS-18Z (Fantom-G8/-G7/-G6), KS-G8 (Fantom-G8), Pedal Switch: DP series, Foot Switch: BOSS FS-5U, Expression Pedal: EV-5, USB Flash Memory: M-UF1G, M-UF128, Microphone: DR series, Headphones: RH-series

Size and Weight
Width: 1,396 mm/ 55 inches
Depth: 502 mm/ 19-13/16 inches
Height/ 183 mm/ 7-1/4 inches
Weight:32.0 kg/ 70 lbs. 9 oz.

[V-CeeOh]

and here are the pics:

[V-CeeOh]

[V-CeeOh]

DETAILS:

Reaching New Levels of Power and Luxury
Introducing the most powerful and luxurious live workstation in Roland history. The Fantom-G8 is a dream instrument that redefines the boundaries of playability and creativity with its advanced sound engine, revolutionary ARX SuperNATURAL™ expansion bay, large-sized color LCD, powerful new audio/MIDI sequencer, first-class “Ivory Feel” weighted keys, and more.

- Advanced sound engine with double wave capacity of previous flagship workstation
- 2 x ARX expansion with SuperNATURAL — the world’s greatest performance-expression technology
- Graphic user interface with extra-large 8.5” wide color LCD and mouse connectivity
- Newly developed onboard audio/MIDI sequencer with 128 tracks including 24 audio tracks
- Multi-FX for each part; up to 22 effects routings can be programmed simultaneously
- Top-of-the-line keyboard action; weighted PHA II “Ivory Feel” keyboard
- Heavy-duty casing with aluminum panel

Advanced Sound Engine
Driven by a powerful new audio processor, the Fantom-G provides new sonic depth and versatility. With twice the wave-ROM capacity of its predecessor, it contains a treasure trove of Roland’s world-famous SRX-quality sounds, but what really sets this instrument apart is its new ARX expansion, which allows additional SuperNATURAL sound-sets and fully dedicated synth and effects engines to be added to this already powerful live workstation.

SuperNATURAL ARX Expansion
Fantom-G provides ARX slots that accommodate two SuperNATURAL expansion boards. SuperNATURAL is Roland’s unique behavior-modeling technology that enables a new level of organic, emotional expression previously unattainable in synthesizers. Applied to traditional-instrument sounds, SuperNATURAL enables the delicate, organic tonal changes and playing nuances of real musical instruments. It’s also a powerful tool for electronic and non-traditional sounds, breathing amazing new life and expression into synthesis.

Power Sequencer Onboard
The Fantom-G is the first Roland instrument to feature Roland’s newly designed power sequencer. In conjunction with the large-size LCD, this pro-level composition tool provides 128 tracks (including 24 audio tracks) in a fully intergraded audio/MIDI graphical environment. A mouse can be also incorporated for computer-like speed and ease. Other convenient features include combo XLR and TRS connector, phantom power for condenser mics, Hi-Z input for guitar and bass, and line input.

Luxurious Extra-Wide LCD
One look and touch and you’ll know that the Fantom-G is an instrument without equal. Only the highest-quality materials have been used to create this dream synth, with a stylish, futuristic design that will turn heads. Front and center is the extra-large 8.5” wide TFT color LCD for enhanced productivity. A first-class assortment of handson controls is provided as well, including eight sliders, four knobs, and ten buttons below the LCD.

Amazing FX
Fantom-G is loaded with a state-of-the-art effects engine, with multi-effects available for each Fantom-G sound/part. In 16-part multi-timbre mode, up to 22 effect routings can be used simultaneously. Create complex setups with 16 insert effects per patch, plus global reverbs and choruses. Mastering effects are provided for polishing songs created with the onboard sequencer.

Supreme Keyboard Feel & Action
The Fantom-G8 is outfitted with Roland’s top-of-the-line PHA II “Ivory Feel” keyboard. This amazing keyboard technology reproduces the real surface feel of ivory acoustic piano keys providing a familiar stability and comfort to the pianist. The white keys have a 2-piece structure which reduces the surface ‘click’ noise when playing. The newly developed keyboard surface material is designed to absorb moisture, ensuring a secure, slip-proof feel that your fingers will love.

[V-CeeOh]

All these are taken from ROLAND.COM and so I'm not responsible for any mistake

[2TIM316]

LOL, I just started a similar thread, but I'm totally willing to defer to this one, since you've done a lot of work here. In fact I'm going to go over and edit my post to point to this one!

First of all, the main data entry knob is much less raised than it appears when viewing the instrument from directly above. This I see from looking at the separate Fantom-G site which Roland has created.

From my perspective it's got some nice advancements like the luxurious display, the enhanced sequencer, the ability to use a mouse, the 24 audio tracks, the 16 patch effects, and so on as described above.

But overriding that for my uses are the following major drawbacks:

1) Still 128 note polyphony. I would expect double that at a minimum for a "flagship" workstation which wants to compete head-on with Motif XS and Korg M3. Roland has offered 128 note polyphony since the XV-5080 was released a number of years ago. This could have been a major selling point. I think they dropped the ball on this. We now have 24 audio tracks, 16 patch effects, yet no more polyphony to spend it on. I predict people will run out of polyphony way before they run out of audio tracks or effects. Bummer!

2) "Only" 256 meg of wave ROM. Again, I would have expected 1 Gig to go with the "G" moniker. Modern software samplers (Kontakt 3) are offering many gigabytes of ROM samples. This amount of ROM merely matches Motif and M3. Again, I think Roland dropped the ball here.

2a) It appears all of the 256 meg of wave ROM is comprised of previous Fantom/XV/JV wave material, some of which has been around for more than a decade. Sure we now get some SRX sounds built-in, but that can be easily accomplished with a standard Fantom-X and the right SRX boards. And really, who wants these same old sounds year after year anyway? Okay, don't answer that, I realize some people do. But note that Yamaha (Motif XS), and Korg (M3) included new sample ROM wave sets with their new instruments. Roland claims a "new audio engine" but it appears to be powering the "old" wave ROM. Bummer!

3) No virtual analog built-in. How long will it take before hardware workstation manufacturers realize that so many users produce dance, hip-hop, and electronica styles that so heavily rely on analog or virtual analog? In all fairness Yamaha has no provision for virtual analog with the Motif XS, and Korg offers it as an option for the M3 with the Radias expansion board. Will Roland's ARX technology allow for virtual analog? If so, when will an ARX virutal analog expansion board be available? The verdict is out. As it stands, we have another rompling workstation on our hands with no provision for any alternate synthesis technology.

Truthfully I could get over the lack of virtual analog by combining the Fantom-G with an analog module such as the new Waldorf Blofeld. But there is no way to get around the polyphony or wave ROM issues for me. That makes the Fantom-G just a Fantom-X with a bigger display, an enhanced sequencer, and a few other bells and whistles. But as many hardware workstation users say, a workstation lives and dies on its sounds, and it appears we have the same Fantom/XV/JV wave ROM being implemented with the same 128 note polyphony which has been available in Roland instruments for many years. I think Roland could have done much better in these critical areas.

And most likely given the fanfare surrounding this new workstation, including the group of well-known artists endorsing the new product (a new marketing strategy for Roland - Yamaha and Korg have been doing it for years), methinks this new Fantom-G ain't gonna be cheap, kids.

Looking forward to others' opinions.

[stevie]

HERE'S MY COPY AND PASTE


Right - I've got mixed feelings.

Sound Engine:
Seems that there is virtually no development from the X. Without any further detailed info. the engine must be the same as the X. I.e 4 stereo tones per patch with the same synthesis options.

This is a real disappointment. Roland are proudly saying that the wave ROM is basically hijacked from the SRX library - well that's fine unless you've already got them all (like me). So sound wise from the Rompler engine, (without expansion), there is no change and offers nothing new at all.

There are NO srx expansions, and only two of the ARX expansions. These look interesting and seem to be complete synthesizers on a card - but they're bound to be expensive. So they aren't a replacement for SRX - they're more than adding addional ROM waves - you're adding a whole new synth. This is clever marketing by Roland - means if you've got the SRX library, you'll have to keep the hardware to run it.

Sequencer:
Awesome - this is where a lot of development has gone. If it's easy to use then this will be class leading.

Effects:
At last, Roland have finally ditched the DSP which first appeared in the JV line up. This architeture gave the limited effects processing power of the X. As long as the new DSP is flexible in assignment, sounds great (Roland usually do), then again this is class leading and along with the sequencer, this is where the development has gone.

Computer Integration:
Still seems sketchy, can it host USB? It seems no futher computer integration from the X.

Look forward to your comments.

Steve

[stevie]

AND:

I'll also add that there doesn't seem to be a rack yet. I'll look forward to that as long as it incorporates more ARX slots.

Thing is though, if you already have a XR with some SRX boards you'll be duplicating the sound set in the 'GR', so you'll only be buying it for the FX and ARX expansion (assuming no sequencer). So it's got to be a good reason for either adding to your XR plus SRX or replacing it - enough ARX boards would probably do that if you're willing to make the investment. So we will see....

Steve

[Mauro Rosati]

Cool, but 128 midi tracks with just 128 voices of poliphony it's a joke, come on. Sure, you don't put 128 midi tracks sounding at the same time, but if you consider that witha piano patch you eat half of the poliphony, well, do you consideration.

[2TIM316]

Hey Vee-CeeOh - could you edit your pictures of the Fantom-G so they don't take up so much screen width. It makes all of the other posts require scrolling to read. Thanks!

[2TIM316]

To amend my previous post - it is possible that like the Motif XS, Roland has so improved the audio engine so as to make the Fantom-G sound very close to "real" analog. The Motif XS to my ears has taken a major step in that direction. But when you listen to a real analog synth like Dave Smith's Prophet 8 or a good virtual analog like the new Waldorf Blofeld, you see the distance between the real thing and the sample of same. That being said, assuming an improvement in "analog" sound, combined with a really well-done library like Artemio's "Planet" series, it is possible that the Fantom-G could show a marked improvement over the sound of the Fantom-X - one that would create some uniqueness for the new instrument.

As regards some other comments so far - Almost certainly we won't see a rack for at least a year, if ever.

+1 for the further comments (from other posters) about the polyphony issue. Right - take a 3 or 4 element sound. Play a couple of full chords which use the sustain pedal, and watch 128 notes get eaten away really fast. Note that many patches, through tricky or sloppy practices, use multiple tones which can't even be heard. Yet they're still turned on, wasting precious polyphony. At 256 this becomes much less of an issue. At 128 it's still critical. Thus the user must go through and audition each tone of each patch, carefully choosing which ones to turn off in order to conserve polyphony. And how much are we going to pay for this thing???

P.S. Vee-CeeOh - I didn't notice in my other thread that you are a moderator. Shows you how long it's been since I've been frequenting these parts. Thanks for locking the other thread. I hope everyone will cooperate and stick to just this one thread. That has been such a problem with other keyboards and other forums - everyone wants the "prestige" of being a thread-starter. I'll try to encourage others to stick with this thread as well.

[V-CeeOh]

Hey Vee-CeeOh - could you edit your pictures of the Fantom-G so they don't take up so much screen width. It makes all of the other posts require scrolling to read.

done

[V-CeeOh]

[and the second pic is here]

[Radek]

Per patch effects, vastly improved sequencer, dramatically better user
interface - F-G looks excellent. Much better than MotifXS or Korg M3.
Actually perhaps even better than Oasys in many regards.

What is bad? Polyphony - indeed. It could be bigger.

256MB of PCM - not that bad. Don't compare it with softsamplers where
developers just waste gigabytes of memory.

128 midi tracks - fantastic! Even if you not use more than 16 timbres it
will allow to make arrangements more conveniently. Doesn't MV series has 128
already?

Better surface controls - big LCD, buttons and faders - perfect.

Still bank based patch storage? Bad... file based please.

Only one audio input and lack of multitrack recording - again I'd expect
something like 4x2 inputs but oh well...

Overall OSes usability - yet to be determined... but by just looking at F-G's
pictures it's clear Roland has much more sense than other newest workstations.

[V-CeeOh]

Let me add that if you want bigger/other pics you should go the G page at Roland.com HERE.

You can also visit the dedicated site Fantom Experience for other info.