Is the Fantom G still relevant in 2018?

[studio460]

I'm still toying with my Fantom G, and admittedly (even after 10 years of ownership), I've still yet to learn many of its intricacies. I've been away from my music for a while and recently thought I'd survey the hardware-synth market once again and see what the Big Three had to offer. The Yamaha Montage looked interesting, but the Korg Kronos immediately stood out, and on paper, this keyboard seemed very impressive. It's like everything the Oasys hoped to be, now fleshed out in a more refined product.

So, a few weeks ago, I decided to buy a refurbished Korg Kronos Platinum, prompted by a deal that looked too good to pass up—the one I got was priced $740 less than a new Kronos, and looks brand-new (I assume it was a return from dealer-stock, and never even saw a customer). I got it mainly to be able to exploit its streaming-SSD technology to install larger sample-libraries for more authentic-sounding strings and orchestra instruments.

But, after buying a pricey third-party orchestral library for my new Kronos, I then learned of Native Instruments' new Komplete Kontrol S61 Mk 2 keyboard and its tight integration with Apple Logic Pro and NKS-enabled VSTs. Wow! What a machine! Now, I'm considering buying the Komplete Kontrol S61 bundle with Komplete 11 Ultimate—all for $100 bucks less than a new Roland FA-08! With this new capability the Mk2 controllers enable, and the power and ease-of-use of Apple Logic Pro X (which I only just downloaded a couple weeks ago), I began to think all of my hardware synths have now become obsolete.

I was just about to take my Fantom G off its shelf to make room for my coming Native Instruments' keyboard and thought I'd play around with some arps. Wow! This board still amazes! For laughs, I pitted a Fantom super-saw patch against the Kronos' 9-engine synth machine, and guess what? The patches sounded virtually identical. Now, I'm starting to feel the love for my Fantom again. I was even tempted to get a Yamaha Montage 7 or used Motif XF6 to round out my collection of ROMplers (I've always wanted a flagship ROMpler from all three manufacturers). But my 10-year-old Fantom still seems to hold its ground.

But when I get my new NI keyboard and Komplete 11 Ultimate bundle, will I still need or want my hardware synths? Is the Fantom G still relevant in a world of Integra-7s, Montages, Kronoses, and super-softsynths like Spectrasonics' Omnisphere 2, Arturia's V Collection, UVI's Falcon, and NI's Komplete 11 library? I just bought UVI's Synth Anthology 2 ($149) for my new Apple DAW, and I love it! So many patches, but so many of them sound "right," just out-of-the-box. No endless preset-surfing and no tweaking necessary (unless you so desire). With UVI's Synth Anthology 2, you get signature sounds from 77 legacy and modern hardware synths, all expertly processed with specialized outboard gear by professional sound designers—highly recommended!

Note that even after I get my Komplete 11 collection, I'm probably still keeping my VirusTI Polar, V-Synth GT, and Korg Radias—they're just too fun to get rid of! They all look super-cool, still sound super-good, and are all in near-mint condition. Plus, they're only worth about half of what I paid originally, so why sell them?

[darkstar audio]

I sold my G8 a couple of years ago, and regretted it until last month when I bought another. Even with the likes of the XF8 (horrible display) and Kronos (sold an original 88, hated the ridiculously small characters on the display, noisy fan and load-up time sufficient to make some toast, and butter it too...), the G8 is simply the best workstation ever made. It's not just me; the market has come alive again, with most 8s going for close to $2000 now. Why? Because nobody makes a proper BEAST flagship anymore.

Why? The build quality. The key action and feel. No, folks, the piece of s**t action on the FA-08 is NOT the same. Not even close, and it's sluggish and non-responsive. The snap of the G8s keys, the amazing feel under your fingers and the overall flagship feel has simply not been recreated.

Once a new G8 owner learns that the presets are questionable, save for maybe NYGrand8 and Aerial Choir, and actually figures out the INSANE power of the effects modules (the reverb is still more powerful and flexible than many dedicated units and pedals), the AMAZING DAs make this beast unstoppable. The sampler is absolutely perfect, and the sequencer is aces.

Yes, there are bugs, and yes, it weights 281 pounds. But nobody has made anything like it, and it's Roland's last real workstation. The thing with the G is... It has too many options, and people tend to get sidetracked with ideas rather than actual work, which has affected it's reputation.

But make no mistake about it- It is still a VERY powerful machine, and in the right hands can fly.

And Howard Jones still loves his.

So there. Heh heh.

[studio460]

Thanks for your comments, darkstar! So glad to hear someone else say it. Again, it blew me away when I played a Fantom super-saw and the Kronos' super-saw and they sounded near-identical. And, I heard you about the Kronos' UI—it's horrible. The only reason I'm keeping it is because I bought an expensive EXs library which I can't return, plus I do like the Kronos' combis. But for the life of me I still have no idea what Karma is.

About the sounds . . . yeah, it's so weird. The Kronos, Montage, etc., always has some great new synth-engine or filters or whatnot, with "10x the sample RAM," and on and on, and when you put it next to its predecessor, they still almost sound the same (hopefully the Montage is different since I'm planing to buy a Montage 7). Enjoyed hearing your thought on this!

[paulmapp8306]

I'm still using my fandom s (61). Still sounds great. I an thinking of switching to an fa07, but only because I want a va/analogue synth but have no room to add another board so need to replace the s with something that has a va section while not looking the arp, seq, drums and rompler stuff the s has.

If the g (or x) had the sns engine is get one of those bit they don't. It's a fa07 or kronos from what I can see. The fa has a much better workflow and is 1/3 the price _ though it does have limitations.

[studio460]

Hey, Paul, I just wanted to throw my $0.02 at you. I'm sure the FA is a great-sounding machine, but also consider leaving Roland for a different sound. My first synths I bought in the early 1990s were all Rolands. Then I happened to find a Roland B-stock guy who lives in the next city who offered me insane deals on B-stock Roland gear, so in the late-2000s I bought more Rolands.

My favorite "lead" synths now are my VirusTI, Korg Radias, and my new UVI plug-in, Synth Anthology 2 (highly recommended!). All produce such great and different sounds. The original VirusTI Polars can be had for only about $1,000-$1,400 on the used market and are 90% as capable as the $3,000 TI2. I'm not saying get a Virus, I'm just suggesting you mix up your brands to get some variety and contrast. Good luck!

Oh, by the way, I just noticed that you mentioned a Kronos. I just got one and they sound great! The combis are really fun for idea-generating and is one the main things I enjoy about the keyboard. But the UI is horrible and the sequencer is from another dimension (from 2005's Oasys ). Very cryptic, complicated, and difficult to navigate—nothing like the built-in audio recorder of the Fantom.

But it is a great board, and there are a TON of high-quality EXs libraries for its massive, built-in 64GB SSD for producing authentic-sounding acoustic instruments (e.g., orchestral strings and brass). You can even add a second SSD, user-tested up to 1TB! I bought a 5GB EXs orchestral library (WavesArt's Cinematic Suite) for my Kronos which is near-VST quality in sound.

[paulmapp8306]

The Kronos has things I like over the FA - the FX section is a beast compared to the 1 per tone (2 in set lists) the FA offers. Another is Karma - I love that (used to have a Karma board).

Thing is, I dont really need a dedicated board "model" so the Poly 6 ans MS engines while a bonus arnt in my thinking. Neither is the piano or organ engines. I have an RD2000 that cover those just fine for me.

Its the FM engine, the AL-1 and the standard PCM engines that of interest.

The AL isnt much better than Rolands SN-S. It has a more powerfull FX matrix and some extra mod options, but is 2 osc v Rolands 3. Its swings and roundabouts there - certainly not worth the extra outlay.

The PCM engine is also not a lot better - bar the FX. There are more waveforms and built in patches, but nothing I cant create on the Roland. Again - there are benefits over the FA but not worth the extra cost.

The FM engine IS worth having and thats the consideration. Is that alone worth the extra? probably not as a VST could do that in the studio - Id only miss it live. Again - there are plenty of FM sounds in the FA - or downloadable to it from Axial (even if its not a true FM engine).


RE going elsewhere - Ive looked.

Ive tried a Sledge, the Nord Leads, the DSI Rev 8, The Korg Prologue, System 8, Deep mind..... Ive not tried a Peak, but dont have the space for a module. Out of those Id take the Rev2 (or one of the more expensive DSI offerings) - but the problem with all of them is they would replace, not add to the Fantom-S. Non of them have a sequencer, or programmable drum tracks, and some dont have a programmable arpegiator. None have standard Rompler sounds (the RD has plenty actually, though there not really user changeable -I might be able to live without those tones if the seq/arp/drums were there and make do with the RDs).

Ive not tried a Virus - but it has the same issues as those above. I would consider a Korg M3 with a Radius board fitted IF I could find one. Should do all I want - the only down side being no real time control on the M3 or knobs to edit the Radius sounds. I could add a control surface though, so It might work.

Other than that - Only the FA-07 (for the keybed - I have a weighted board in the RD already, and dont like the 06 slimmed down keys) and Kronos seem to fit. Its price v the extra functionality (or limitations in the FA - in the Mod front and FX section). I dont see any other boards that have all I want.

[studio460]

Pardon me, Paul! Clearly you know your synths and have done your research! Let me know what you decide!

[paulmapp8306]

No need to apologise, Im struggling to actually choose, so any opinions from those already using such boards is useful.

I just wish I had space in my room for a 3rd tier (live that wouldnt be an issue) - then I could just add a stand lone synth (board like the Rev2 or module like the peak) and Id be sorted.

[Quinnx.]

What can I say. Fandom X/G are still as good as ever, I have both and for awhile I even went back to using the fantom X. Possibilities are pretty much endless with these workstations. The latest greatest is not always required to make great music and without a doubt the Fantom is the most versatile Synth/Sampler workstation one can have in their armory.

[piaknowguy]

Quinnx +1

[Andy Keys]

I'm still gigging regularly with my X7. The only concerns I have for its long term future are the zero availability of parts, should anything fail, and the sample loading times.

Don't tell my Fantom, but I have been looking at the Kurzweil Forte lately...

[viperwolf]

This is something I worry about, Im still using my fantom. If something goes wrong, I guess ill have to update.

[FPHam]

I had FA08, sold it after a year and just got Fantom G6 recently.
The FA is certainly better sounding as it is a mixture of the G type sounds and the new integra sounds. However it is also more oriented towards computer editing while the G was build as a fully standalone. I am not even sure why they still keep the sequencer on FA - it is not likely people would use it on the small display vs editing on computer. The Fantom G with the large display and mouse is still usable but I say only "just" if we compare it with doing the same on PC or mac.
The FA08 keyboard was actually good in general (I never had chance to try G8 - I only heard good things) but I already have digital piano which I like more. The biggest problem is that FA08 was really a heavy piano keyboard - they even put an escapement in it - but that's just handful of presets that would benefit from it. It was actually counterproductive to use it on non piano sounds like synths and other 1000 sounds.

A little disappointment were actually the free axial expansions. It sounds great in theory but let's be honest those are some ancient tiny samples in them... still some sounded "interesting" and it gives you something to do for few weeks (it is a truly enormous amount of old presets and sounds) but my ipad sounds better. I understand why they are free now because I don't think anybody would pay for them too much. Maybe the oriental pack was interesting as it filled hole, but most are just worse duplicate sounds than they are already in FA.

The FA08 pianos supernaturals are something to get accustomed. It is brilliant but for a solo it's just too clean, too sterile.
The Fantom G was the peak of workstations before ipads changed everything. Also the GUI and easy access is pretty legendary on it. I used to have Korg and their new interface is a total chaos - I honestly could not work it out without manual in hand. I did not get manual with the G, and I easily figured most of the basic functionality the first day.
The question of relevancy is irrelevant. The sounds are still good as ever and you can really layer a nice huge live patch that sounds as big as you need and sweeten it with effects. Now the other stuff like audio recording, resampling etc may not be relevant to the PC oriented crowd (or even ipad), but they are a nice free bonus. I did not use the FA sequencer single time while I had it (it is like using sequencer on a phone), but I already have some plans for the G (mouse is da King) and intend to use it as a simple multitrack for audio.

There is also another FA issue that is not often mentioned - the supernatural sounds are very oscillator intensive. So you have big polyphony on paper but each layer of SN sound will divide the available polyphony like 4 times or more times. So naturally you want to make big patch with all the sweet sweet SN sounds only to realize that you layer 3 of them and there is totally chance of big note stealing. I know because that was first thing I did and no all the 8 layers are useless you just can't use them with the SN sounds or the sound will be choppy with just few fingers on the keyboard. Don't even think of holding sustain pedal. That's just kills it all together. The fantom G "stupid" sounds are more oscillator conservative so you can do a pretty big layer and still not much downside.

[davidkordzgeorge]

I would say the Fantom G is still relevant. I bought mine in 2013 to gig with and I still gig with it and I'm now starting to delve into the sequencer even more for pre production purposes. I love the sounds and the flexibility it gives me on a gig. I am tempted by some of the new boards out but for now I have to use what I have to do the job. I thought I would just throw my 2 pennies worth in too :-)

[middle c]

The G8 controls several other synths via midi, so I can incorporate the B model D, Radius and TR 8. Also able to layer with XP 30 getting interesting colors. Skip back sample and sequencer are useful in building RPS loops. The controllers use the filters in the analog synths, including the Juno 106. Everything clocked to the G8. I do use a DAW for recording and mix/master, this is where the computer shines, but hardware for creation is for me.
So yes, the G8 is still relevant today, Roland did good on the G8 and the V Synth.

My only issue is the Windows 10 driver, I'm running Windows 7 and the audio through the mix in function via USB from the computer to grab sample material off the internet does not work with Windows 10.