Question about CF card storage

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gcoudert67
Posts: 195
Joined: 12:58, 19 August 2014
Location: Dunstable, UK

Question about CF card storage

Post by gcoudert67 »

Hi!

I'd like to perform a CF card backup of the content of the user memory on my Fantom X8 (I already have a backup on my PC). I have lots of CF cards to do this on but I would please like to know if such a backup would overwrite the existing content of the card or would it be stored alongside the card's patches, samples, etc., (assuming there is enough space on it, i.e.64Mb according to the manual)? The manual does not refer to this in any way.

If there is a risk of wiping the card's content, how do I back it up first? Do I copy the card's content to my PC via USB?

Thanks,
Gilles
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LA Keys
Posts: 303
Joined: 05:59, 22 July 2014
Location: LA

Re: Question about CF card storage

Post by LA Keys »

Well, in my case I usually backup the card directly on my PC since it have a card reader. I strongly suggest that you do the same via USB.

Last time I've checked there was indeed a BACKUP directory on my CF card, with a subdirectory named ROLAND with the usual directory under it: PNL, SEQ, SMPL, SND. (The BACKUP directory is at the same level as the usual ROLAND directory)

This being said I'm not 100% sure how it got created and because of this I cannot guarantee that a backup would not overwrite some of the content of the CF card.

Better be safe than sorry I think :)


LA
gcoudert67
Posts: 195
Joined: 12:58, 19 August 2014
Location: Dunstable, UK

Re: Question about CF card storage

Post by gcoudert67 »

Thanks! I'll back up the card, give it a try and report back.
gcoudert67
Posts: 195
Joined: 12:58, 19 August 2014
Location: Dunstable, UK

Re: Question about CF card storage

Post by gcoudert67 »

OK, I have tried it and it worked fine. The backup did not affect the card's existing content.
Credo
Posts: 62
Joined: 10:38, 29 January 2015

Re: Question about CF card storage

Post by Credo »

gcoudert67 wrote:Hi!

I'd like to perform a CF card backup of the content of the user memory on my Fantom X8 (I already have a backup on my PC). I have lots of CF cards to do this on but I would please like to know if such a backup would overwrite the existing content of the card or would it be stored alongside the card's patches, samples, etc., (assuming there is enough space on it, i.e.64Mb according to the manual)? The manual does not refer to this in any way.

If there is a risk of wiping the card's content, how do I back it up first? Do I copy the card's content to my PC via USB?

Thanks,
Gilles
Note: Since our Fantoms are aging....I personally work from data cards as much as possible, and keep my writes to the internal flash memory as limited as possible. I do update some patches every now and then in user memory area, and keep a few samples in there that I'm sure to use in pretty much 'every session'....but I generally avoid writing to user memory unless it's a solid gold change that's set in stone as a standard in my repertoire.

Back to the data cards:

If you want to keep multiple copies, or different sets of data on a single larger card, you can rename the top directory as needed.

Example:
I have a 2gig card here. On this card I have more than one set-up, each in its own directory.
CHURCH-GIG
CLUB-GIG
FACTORY-BU
STUDIO-A
STUDIO-A-TMP
EMPTY-TMP
ROLAND
TMP

The Fantom boots from and uses whatever is in directories named: "ROLAND" and "TMP".

Note, I use the term 'boot' loosely. By this I mean, if you've set samples to auto-load from a data-card, they are going to come from the ROLAND sample directories. The patches in the ROLAND directory are what will show up as data-card patches. Also, some types of 'back-up' processes might automatically load themselves into user memory depending on the model of your Fantom.

It's possible to manually load individual patches, sequences, sample, etc...from other directories by searching for them with the Fantom control panel, but if you want to load an entire set at boot time, then change your directories around.

So, if I want to change from my STUDIO-B setup to my STUDIO-A setup then I use either the Fantom itself, or my PC to rename "ROLAND" to "STUDIO-B". If I have stuff in the TMP directory that I want to preserve, then I also rename that to STUIOD-B-TMP. Next, I change "STUDIO-A" to "ROLAND' and "STUDIO-A-TMP" to "TMP".

Note that in my example above I don't have TMP directories for all my setups. In the case of my STUDIO setups, I sometimes have bits in the TMP directory I want to preserve. In cases where I know it's empty anyway, or no longer needed...I can just start with my EMPTY-TMP folder that has nothing in it but the proper directory structure.

If you're wanting to do a complete 'user memory backup', then simply rename the current ROLAND and TMP folder to something else for the moment. Do your back-up and there should be new ROLAND and TMP folders now (If not, you'll probably find a new folder called BACKUP). Now you can rename to change between the setups as desired. Some models might also keep a separate BACKUP folder in lieu of overwriting the ROLAND folder (you can rename these as well, to have multiple versions).

Don't forget that if you use this method of renaming the top directory, you'll want to reboot the Fantom before it will start using your card data if it is a 'user memory back-up'. In some models you might have to manually force the Fantom to move the back-up into user memory.

If it is a 'data card' setup with auto loading samples, then reboot. Otherwise, you can pull the card and reinsert it a time or two and all the card patches/sample maps/etc on 'data-card' should reflect what is in your card's ROLAND directory, and you can 'manually' load and unload samples from there.

There also might be the case where you want to load everything from a card into user memory, and then change to another directory on the data card to use that as 'extended data card' memory. In that case...you'd save the user memory area as a backup. Boot/load from that directory when you need to have all that in user memory....rename your directories to whatever 'data card' setup you want, pull the card, then reinsert it. At that point you should be able to access your card memory now as well.

Yes, you can drag/copy any of these directories onto your PC using a media reader, or with the Fantom's own USB interface. You can zip/pack them on your hard drive, or even burn CDs/DVDs if you like. Just remember to unzip/copy them back to a card when you get ready to use it in the Fantom.

It's also a good idea to drop a simple text file in the folder that describes and explains your set-up. This way if you ever forget your naming scheme....or just have a lapse of memory of what the set-up is....you've got a file in there explaining it for you :)
I.E.
In my STUDIO-A directory, I used my PC to make a text file named STUDIO-A.txt
In that text file I have notes about what samples are there, how they're mapped and used in various patches/songs, information about how I've tweaked patches and set up MIDI controllers, etc. I also sometimes drop small sysex or MIDI files in there that actually go with my DAW. Taking a moment to make these notes really has saved me a lot of grief (especially after taking a long break from a project)!

The key to keeping it all straight is to remember that the Fantom considers ROLAND and TMP as its default boot/working directories.

When starting with a brand new card, it's not a bad idea to first initialize it from the Fantom itself. After that, it should be compatible with a PC or Mac (and other devices as well).

You can in theory, also treat 'user memory' like a data card in respect to renaming directories and swapping setups as described above. I personally advise against it these days with our aging Fantoms, since flash ram of that era does have a limit to the number of reliable rewrites it can handle. Each year, it gets more difficult to repair or replace internal Fantom parts....but getting a new Data Card is still pretty easy, so do your heavy writing and moving stuff around on data cards where possible :) Plan user memory writes as conservatively as possible to prolong the life of your Fantom.

Hope this helps...
Brian
gcoudert67
Posts: 195
Joined: 12:58, 19 August 2014
Location: Dunstable, UK

Re: Question about CF card storage

Post by gcoudert67 »

Thanks for the info, Brian. This certainly is a very clever way of managing data and I think I am going to give it a go.
Currently, my main CF card contains my favourite patches from the old SR-JV80 cards (adapted for the Fantom - I have 3 SRX cards in the X8) as well as lots of drum samples and kits from all the classic drum machines. It also holds my user area backup. Load up time is just under 2 minutes.
The patches I create are saved to the user area and I have a number of favourite samples in there too (DX7, Fairlight CMI & Emulator stuff among other things).
My other CF cards are dedicated to DX7, PPG, etc. sample-based patches.

I absolutely adore my Fantom. I've had it for 9 months now and do not regret selling my Jupiter 50 in order to buy it.
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