to be honest, I'm not happy that we have the same conversation about the same things all over different topics. I'll admit, it's my fault too, but I'm just wondering (not that I take it really personally) that some of you can't stand or even remotely accept my opinion just because I don't praise Roland or their products as the best thing that every happened to the mankind.
I don't really have a problem with those members here who like the jp80 up to the point that they try to justify absolutely every single aspect, every design decision on that keyboard, regardless how intuitive or flawed it may seem. Unfortunately, some others seems to have a religious problem with different opinions.
It's always the same problem. Somebody just wants to turn the keyboard on and play and enjoy the sounds. Some of those people refuse to understand that others are more interested on some technical aspects of the keyboard because it matters to them what they can do with the keyboard or cannot.
Whenever somebody posts a raving prise to the jp80, I'm not trying to convince him to the opposite, nor am I trying to correct him. But whenever I try to point out my caveats, my concerns with that keyboard, you or HE who's name should not be spoken aloud jumps in, telling me that my arguments are weak or that I make futile rebuttals.
With such an ingenious lack of understanding what discussion and argumentation is all about, this sub forum is going to be a place where in future three or four members will stay as the last Mohicans, competing each other who will say a bigger praise to either the company or their product.
Now to the Motif part, which you always pull out as a joker argument:
I don't have a Motif. I'm not a motif user, I don't really like the technical aspects of the Motif. I only like how it sounds. That's the reason why I don't own a motif. Because, regardless of how nice it sounds, it prevents me to do things in the way and how I like or - more important - need to do them.
But, I'm wondering how you fail to understand that your debating is going completely in the wrong direction. If we discuss about multitimbral aspects of the JP80, even comparing it to another keyboard, please, let's stay focused on that part. Don't push it over to some new elements we are not talking about. Nobody ever said that the Motif wins in every single aspect. So, why do you over and over again reach for the same new arguments which have nothing to do with what we are actually talking about?
The motif is not designed to allow seamless switching. There are some workarounds for those who absolutely need it. But, the Motif doesn't have seamless switching. On the other side: the JP80 doesn't have a sampler. So, whenever you reach for that seamless switching argument, I can recall the missing sampler or even the sequencer.
Or in other words: when I complain about the absolutely screwed up file structure on the jp80 (meaning how it saves/loads its sounds), I'm told that there is nothing wrong with the jp80 because it works as intended. So, let me use that same argument and tell you that there is absolutely nothing wrong with how you change sounds on the Motif, because it works as it's intended to work. And you can apply that "genius" argument whenever somebody complains about anything.
Let me just comment on some other statements you made:
Ok now change your sounds with a footswitch? Oh no? Can't do?
Of course you can do that. You don't even need a motif to figure it out. Just read the manual.
Say you want to change the right hand patch to a piano? So you enter song mode and start turning off layers and changing something to piano...cursoring about.
Why on earth would you turn of layers if you want to change one sound to another? No, you can't do it as fast as on the JP80. I for my part always know what I need on the stage. It never happened to me that I was on a stage with my keyboard, having a pad/trumpet split, where I said "oh, f.ck, I actually want a piano instead of the trumpet". I appreciate that possibility on the jp80, but it's nowhere near a live saver. You select preset favorite patches with that buttons below the display. You can't access any patch you may want or need. That's what every keyboarder has to do at home. Even on the Motif you could make some splits where you have different patches for the right hand and save them inside the same performance bank or group. You'll be able to select them with a single press on one of the 16 patch select buttons.
Assuming that you don't care if your sounds cut off how many steps are there to deep edit one of those elements? Well first you'd have to leave song mode and enter voice mode, hit edit and select the layer.
That's not true. You can edit patches on the motif right in the song mode and save all those edits as part of that song without using the user patch memory. You can simply transfer your songs to any other motif without overwriting any patches on that other keyboard. And by saying that, you can of course edit the patches in the multitimbral context, not outside of your bigger patch. I didn't count the steps, but you wouldn't mind I hope if it requires 2 or 3 more button presses.
With 4 simple controls I can bring in layers at will. On the Motif you'll be muting multiple tracks in song mode to do the same thing.
Multiple tracks in the song mode can be activated or muted by one single button press. All tracks with the same midi channel can be activated or deactivated with a single button press! I guess it's faster to recall some layers with a single press of a button, instead of turning a knob left or right.
I would bet you a chicken dinner no pro musician uses song mode to control the Motif.
Let me tell you, I almost hate when the term "pro musician" is used as an argument for something. What is a pro musician? Imagine a band where the keyboarder uses backing tracks for every single song! Regardless of the keyboard type, this keyboarder have to use the song mode. So, what's wrong in using the song mode and its advances instead of the performance mode? It's called song mode, not non-pro-song mode. You are free to use any mode in anyway you may like. Nothing in that regard will make you pro or non pro.
I would bet a steak dinner the guy playing the local tavern isnt using it either.
And what is your point? What's the logical conclusion here? The local tavern musician is a professional because he doesn't use the song mode! Or, songs which are played in local taverns are so easy on the keyboard side, that they never need more than 4 parts which are available on the motif performance mode.
They use performance mode, the same thing Dan showed on the video.
Unlike you, I'll never make statements what other people use or don't use. I know people who are "pro musicians", playing in "pro bands" and who are exclusively using the song mode for their multitimbral setups. I also know "pro musicians" who exclusively use the patch mode and don't use any single multitimbral setup, neither the performance mode nor the song mode.
Be careful on betting dinners and assuming how other people use their keyboards. I even know a Fantom X user who exclusively uses the song mode for his multitimbral setups, and don't forget, the Fan X has 16 parts in its performance mode! It has something to do with the way how he can select sounds in the song mode and he can't do the same in the Fan X performance mode.