Bye bye Jupiter 80

Forum for JUPITER-80
piangio
Posts: 5
Joined: 10:09, 4 February 2013

Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by piangio »

At last my Jupiter went away. I wrote to Roland if they were planning an editor - Librarian for pc or i-pad. They just answered: no plan!
So I switched to Korg Kronos.
I think that Jupiter is a very good instrument but Roland doesn't support it as I would like.
Good bye friends!
thunderkyss
Posts: 837
Joined: 07:38, 21 May 2003
Location: Port Arthur,TX

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by thunderkyss »

Good riddance
Vlad_77
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Location: The Netherlands

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by Vlad_77 »

piangio wrote:At last my Jupiter went away. I wrote to Roland if they were planning an editor - Librarian for pc or i-pad. They just answered: no plan!
So I switched to Korg Kronos.
I think that Jupiter is a very good instrument but Roland doesn't support it as I would like.
Good bye friends!
Your needs are your needs of course, but, I own both and a number of others - and yes I am poor - and would never get rid of an instrument just because there was no editor for it! I wonder how much time you actually put into the Jupiter 80? It really is a profoundly powerful synth and it's quite easy to edit. I am also a Kurzweil owner. I LOVE the instrument, but, even with the Sound Tower editor, you still need to understand what the Kurzweil is doing. No editor is going to do the job for you.

As a Kronos user I can tell you this: certain engines like STR-1, MOD-7, and AL-1 are NOT easy to program even with an editor and for the reasons I've cited above.

Not to sound like an old codger because I'm not, but, here's a hypothetical question: if you scored an Oberheim Matrix 12 or a Jupiter 8, would you dump either because no editor exists for them?

Sorry man, but, it's about the music, not the bloody editors IMHO.

I will concede that Roland isn't exactly brilliant when it comes to after market support, but, there is enough potential in the Jupiter 80 to explore for many lifetimes.

Have fun with Kronos, it IS a GREAT instrument but I think you will regret getting rid of your Jupiter 80. Maybe if cash permits - if indeed it's an issue at all - maybe you'll reconsider and add a Jupiter to your Kronos. I and many others can testify to the fact that these two instruments play so beautifully together it's eerie.
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SoundworldA.D.
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Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by SoundworldA.D. »

Back in 2010 or so, we all wrote to Korg and asked "hey man, what is going on with the OASYS? Where is all of the Open Architecture stuff that we were promised?" Answers were hard to come by! The surreptitious behavior and silence from Korg as we found out later was because the OASYS for all intents and purposes was to be shortly thereafter officially discontinued and resources were no doubt tied up on what would become the KRONOS (the "OASYS for the masses" as I like to call it).

Would I get rid of my beloved OASYS or refuse to buy another Korg product because of this? Of course not! I buy synth's for their sounds, and a great synth is still a great synth, no matter what the age or lack of some computer gadgets.

You cannot go wrong with a KRONOS for sure, and for the money it is more powerful and more suited to so many more things because it is a full-blown workstation. The Jupiter-80 on the other hand has a bizarre architecture that takes some getting used to and the lack of a librarian and the idiotic way that it loads and duplicates tones and chews up needed space is of course a major burden.

But I could not for one instant ever think of dumping it because of one thing and one thing only...the sounds. As cello, Dany, Vlad and so many others (yes, even Mr. Knolan!) have found out, if you take the time to learn it and love it, editor or no, the rewards far surpass the shortcomings.

And as Vlad said, the only thing better than a(n) OASYS/KRONOS is the combination of them with the Jupiter. Of course I would have to throw the fantastic elastic V-Synth into the mix as well...let's just call it a "Mighty Triumvirate of Sound."

Best of luck with the KRONOS. Too bad Roland's lack of support has deprived you of having even more beautiful sounds.
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Tom_1970
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Location: The Netherlands

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by Tom_1970 »

I can understand the wish for a librarian, but the interface of the Jupiter 80 is one of it's strongest features for me (besides the sound of course).
I was very happy with the ipad editor, but I must admit I never really use it. The touchscreen interface and the knobs makes it a wonderful instrument to edit and tweak.

It is said more than once on this forum, although maybe in different words:
Never buy an instrument for what it maybe could do in the future, buy an instrument for what it can do now.!

For me this is a sort of a studio adagium.

I guess in the end it's your loss.
Pitty.
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PauloF
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Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by PauloF »

Tom_1970 wrote:I can understand the wish for a librarian, but the interface of the Jupiter 80 is one of it's strongest features for me (besides the sound of course).
I was very happy with the ipad editor, but I must admit I never really use it. The touchscreen interface and the knobs makes it a wonderful instrument to edit and tweak.

It is said more than once on this forum, although maybe in different words:
Never buy an instrument for what it maybe could do in the future, buy an instrument for what it can do now.!

For me this is a sort of a studio adagium.

I guess in the end it's your loss.
Pitty.

"One Man's garbage disposal is another Man's treasure"...

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Quinnx.
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Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by Quinnx. »

Integration is the key these days..
The 1st thing I Looked for when the jp was released was a VST and editor and I could see straight away
it was not going to be, this made the JP a closed architecture and now even more so with the Integra.

These days a VST at least... is 33% of the whole deal..
and since i feel roland live from the initial sales of any new item, if they wanna ensure the heartbeat remains a little longer on sales even when tapering they need to include this.
But alas!
the JP and integra have past their initial sell by date so roland have no incentive to provide any further support past this sell by date.
For future goers of roland gear..
If its not there on product release date.. dont expect it anytime soon.
I think someone at roland had a moment of weakness when they decided to include a VST with the FantomG
which to me makes it the most powerfull piece of roland gear released to date. :)
Wavestrike
Posts: 28
Joined: 19:55, 22 July 2013

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by Wavestrike »

I have leared one thing, if you don't like a Roland product you are looking at as it sits in the store, you never will.

They are a slow, behemoth corporation. They probably don't even know that Cyclone Analogic is copying the TB-303 down to the last screw and even copying the box it came in!

They don't know analog gear is "hot" right now.

They don't know what a Virus TI 2 is with total integration.

So now you have learned, Roland gear is very useful and beautiful to me, I have had the Fantom X 88 and loved it, a Jupiter 6 which I love the best and a J-80 that "gets by" but I have no expectations beyond the showroom.
skinmechanic
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Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by skinmechanic »

I think it's all personal choice. When I looked at the Jupiter 80 this summer (bought it 2nd user fairly cheap).

My set-up consisted of already the Integra-7, V-SynthXT, Korg M3 and the Yamaha MOX61.

I have always tried to get something that gave me the "Bread & Butter" sounds as my hardware. The thinking behind this for me is I use Sonar Producer (Now X3) and basically have NI Komplete Ultimate and the full Arturis synths bundle. So for me if I am wanting an analogue type electronic sound I would always plump for a plugin, for convenience purposes. As the majority of my musical work is studio based I have no need to look (yet) at live set-ups. The JP-80 for me was bought to get into programming the synth and dig deeper into the Supernatural synth side of things, it was also a great mainboard for the studio, loved the look and feel of it, so it replaced my ageing Korg M3, I also recently replaced my MOX6 with the MoXF6, the again the integration with VST3 plugin makes it work well with the way I have my workflow into my DAW

I don't miss not having an editor for the Jupiter as I purely use it for programming synth sounds, which it's great for. However I think it is missing a librarian to manage the sounds, librarians go back 20 or so years even more and the only thing I am not keen on and wished they updated is the naff file system it incorporates. Rolands Fantom series and V-Synth series had the same issue, but they had the librarians.

My main gripe is with the Integra that it doesn't have an editor and in this day and age of computer recording a sound module should have the plugin to deal with the editing.
Dewdman42
Posts: 137
Joined: 00:42, 14 January 2013

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by Dewdman42 »

Yep, a librarian is really needed bad. Oh well. its definitely a unique synth with a unique sound. you either love it or you don't
JeffB63
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Joined: 19:28, 19 June 2011
Location: Hampshire. UK.

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by JeffB63 »

Hope you're not planning on using the Kronos VST editor in a 64 bit host because you'll once again be sorely disappointed!

Also no ASIO drivers for the built in audio interface.

The grass is not always greener.

I've recently been contemplating getting rid of the Kronos and getting a JP80!
thunderkyss
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Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by thunderkyss »

Am I missing something here? The OP is from Nov 2013, saying he ditched his Jupiter-80 because Roland said they weren't going to develop an editor for it. But Synthopia reviewed a patch editor in May 2010.

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kimsnarf
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Location: Oslo, Norway

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by kimsnarf »

thunderkyss wrote:Am I missing something here? The OP is from Nov 2013, saying he ditched his Jupiter-80 because Roland said they weren't going to develop an editor for it. But Synthopia reviewed a patch editor in May 2010.
I think he means a more extensive editor beyond single tones. However, the missing librarian is the most pressing issue, given the complexity of the sound structure and the lack of assistance from the built-in system.
OMNICELL
Posts: 18
Joined: 16:13, 3 June 2007

Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by OMNICELL »

No editor; I fully understand. You don't want to get ripped of by the company; its a scary thing to let down your integrity.. Its dangerous and worth moving on unless you know what your doing..

Im not sure yet. I think Im going to end up with one of these without an editor....

latency within the recording structure between the audio interface and DAW is what Im interested in.

Ive listened to the Jupiter 80; its got drums a VA synth, aftertouch. It has recording capabilities. And a big window; the most important part!

Id be interested in knowing if a midi controller might ad some nobs to this thing... Not sure if would help!

For recording, its one track at a time, so I have no problems... My audio interface choice is more important!

Problem;

I love roland stuff; Im not happy with the company, they scare me! So, I feel a bit hostage because I end up going back to roland in the face of danger..

And Im seriously looking at that new drum machine... TR 808
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Saxifraga
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Re: Bye bye Jupiter 80

Post by Saxifraga »

I think Roland and Korg both lack the necessary skills in the IT department to implement a useful mechanism to get control over patch management. What they produced in the last decade was utter bullshit. The Fantom librarian is a cheap joke and Korg still has the 1995 design of UI and the same error messages and workflow from those days. No Roland nor any Korg synth is able to use the modern Linux/NT/OSX filesystems with long filenames and filepaths. Korgs Kronos even leave inconsistent data on disk because of not checking before writing. But instead of people standing up and demanding better quality for their money I got baned for stating the obvious multiple times to the man in charge. So criticism = troll these days!? So much for the independence of the Korg forum.

The truth is that problems like the handling of trees of connected data, that depend on each other and branch into leaves are long solved by a system called:relational database with referential integrity.
Why can both synth manufacturers not use what even any smartphone uses these days? There is sqlight and mysql and other products they can be used to manage sets and patches. The problem may be that they are specialists for writing DSP code and soldering and lack specialists in the programming department.
The JP80 iPad Editor seems to be a dumb frontend to the Integra 7 and JP80 that only shows a fake UI that just sends SysEx messages and does nothing else. It looks like Roland and Korg are just not able to deliver state of the art anymore.

It´s really a ironic that my EMC K4r Editor from 1991 on Atari ST can handle Multis and their dependencies on patches better than anything Korg and Roland have produced in that regard in the last years. With that Editor I can drag Multis into a new bank and all the patches are copied accordingly and are checked for doubles. You also get warned visually wich Multis are changed by changing a patch they depend on. If you try to remove a patch from a bank you get a warning while dependencies exist. And all that without a modern db system. The executable was beneath 128kB. lol

jm2c
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