I jus seen a machine on the Musician's freind book that seems to be a step in the direction that you spoke of when you said that you could'nt imagine it would'nt be long when one of these companies would make a machine that would make audio/track and and midi/track rec seamlessly in the same machine. Tascam's SX-1LE workstation seems to be pretty close to opening that door. it's both a hard disk recorder, and a 128 track midi sequencer rolled into one. even though it seems alot like a hybrid, it doesn't look too bad for the price! I wouldn't run out and get one just yet cuz I know in a couple years they'll be alot better.
If you have'nt done so already, look it up & tell me what you think.
I think the next step is to put a keyboard & a sound generator on them mugz!
Septimo
for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
the SX-1LE contains a 128 track sequencer, but as you say, no MIDI sound module. Not having the keyboard either, it falls a long way short of the "all in one" synth/audio workstation.
The new Tascam 2488 does include a 64-voice sound module (GM only), but doesn't include a sequencer.
Even if they don't include the keyboard, surely it can't be long before someone at least integrates DAW/MIDI Sequencer/MIDI Synth, into one box, each of a good standard (i.e. not GM modules).
But then again perhaps not. Perhaps they think it is integration taken too far, and that the flexibility of separate modules is better. And than better interfacing through something like mLan to link them is preferrable.
However, the market for the all-in-one devices probably exists. Roland keep putting more and more into their BOSS digital recorders for example, the latest has a very comprehensive drum machine. So perhaps it will happen first at the bottom/middle end of the market
Loz
The new Tascam 2488 does include a 64-voice sound module (GM only), but doesn't include a sequencer.
Even if they don't include the keyboard, surely it can't be long before someone at least integrates DAW/MIDI Sequencer/MIDI Synth, into one box, each of a good standard (i.e. not GM modules).
But then again perhaps not. Perhaps they think it is integration taken too far, and that the flexibility of separate modules is better. And than better interfacing through something like mLan to link them is preferrable.
However, the market for the all-in-one devices probably exists. Roland keep putting more and more into their BOSS digital recorders for example, the latest has a very comprehensive drum machine. So perhaps it will happen first at the bottom/middle end of the market
Loz
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
Perhaps this is what you all are talking about. 
http://www.openlabs.com/neko.php
Interesting product. Not sure if I'd want something like that though.
Nathan Sheldon
http://www.nathansheldon.com/
http://www.openlabs.com/neko.php
Interesting product. Not sure if I'd want something like that though.
Nathan Sheldon
http://www.nathansheldon.com/
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
Yes - seen that
I was thinking of something more from the Roland/Korg/Yamaha type clan (i.e. the music hardware oriented folk), rather than a PC in Sheep's clothing
However, it might be that a PC-based approach is the way to go. I discussed with the Microsoft folks responsible for their embedded OS (Win CE) the opportunity for embedding it in the next gen of music hardware. The interesting thing is that in bulk, manufacturers can licence the core very, very cheap, which means it adds little to the cost. This is basically XP for use in embedded only (i.e. it cannot be a general purpose computer), but that means it would be able to run a wealth of PC based music software.
Loz
I was thinking of something more from the Roland/Korg/Yamaha type clan (i.e. the music hardware oriented folk), rather than a PC in Sheep's clothing
However, it might be that a PC-based approach is the way to go. I discussed with the Microsoft folks responsible for their embedded OS (Win CE) the opportunity for embedding it in the next gen of music hardware. The interesting thing is that in bulk, manufacturers can licence the core very, very cheap, which means it adds little to the cost. This is basically XP for use in embedded only (i.e. it cannot be a general purpose computer), but that means it would be able to run a wealth of PC based music software.
Loz
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
seen that also Nathan, but never read into it or took it too seriously, cuz I always thought that was a company experimenting in that field.
But is that machine also a DAW? or what the heck does it do?
what ever it does it's clearly an experiment, and they AIN'T takin my money!! I'll wait for Roland or Yamaha to fiddle with that project..
Septimo
But is that machine also a DAW? or what the heck does it do?
what ever it does it's clearly an experiment, and they AIN'T takin my money!! I'll wait for Roland or Yamaha to fiddle with that project..
Septimo
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
Hello gentlemen.
Loz: Yes, I put that link there almost as a joke, though the concept is intriguing. Windows CE may be a viable option, though if I were an instrument manufacturer, I don't think I'd want to rely on Microsoft to apply necessary alterations to their OS in order for my newly revised controller or sound source to work properly. Some parts of CE are open-source which makes some tweaking possible. Others parts are not. Its not exactly Windows XP for embedded systems. They are actually completely different operating systems with a similar GUI. CE is much more portable to different CPU architectures but has VERY different APIs than Windows XP. A developer would not be able to simply re-compile their XP code for CE, they'd have to rewrite a lot of the code.
Septimo: I haven't looked into those devices much myself. Yes, they do seem experimental. Seeing as they run Windows XP Professional on standard hardware (wrapped in a keyboard shell as Lawrence pointed out) and as they allow for a full size PCI card to be installed, yes, they could act as Digital Audio Workstations. Like you though, I'm hesitant to invest money I really don't have into something that may not be supported a year or two from now. If I had money to burn, I'd probably get one just to experiment with. To see what happens when I install Linux or something on it. Ha!
Nathan Sheldon
http://www.nathansheldon.com/
Loz: Yes, I put that link there almost as a joke, though the concept is intriguing. Windows CE may be a viable option, though if I were an instrument manufacturer, I don't think I'd want to rely on Microsoft to apply necessary alterations to their OS in order for my newly revised controller or sound source to work properly. Some parts of CE are open-source which makes some tweaking possible. Others parts are not. Its not exactly Windows XP for embedded systems. They are actually completely different operating systems with a similar GUI. CE is much more portable to different CPU architectures but has VERY different APIs than Windows XP. A developer would not be able to simply re-compile their XP code for CE, they'd have to rewrite a lot of the code.
Septimo: I haven't looked into those devices much myself. Yes, they do seem experimental. Seeing as they run Windows XP Professional on standard hardware (wrapped in a keyboard shell as Lawrence pointed out) and as they allow for a full size PCI card to be installed, yes, they could act as Digital Audio Workstations. Like you though, I'm hesitant to invest money I really don't have into something that may not be supported a year or two from now. If I had money to burn, I'd probably get one just to experiment with. To see what happens when I install Linux or something on it. Ha!
Nathan Sheldon
http://www.nathansheldon.com/
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
Nathan, sorry I was mixing up Win CE and XP embedded in the same conversation there.
The next release of Win CE makes it much easier to port your XP apps across and use the same tools. And it was in the context of the new release I was talking to them about the music market.
(but we digress....)
Loz
The next release of Win CE makes it much easier to port your XP apps across and use the same tools. And it was in the context of the new release I was talking to them about the music market.
(but we digress....)
Loz
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
Hey Loz.
Thanks for the info. I must admit that I do not keep up with the CE scene on a regular basis as I have nothing that uses that OS. The implementation of the .NET APIs is a big step forward for developers though!
Thanks again for the insight.
Nathan Sheldon
http://www.nathansheldon.com/
Thanks for the info. I must admit that I do not keep up with the CE scene on a regular basis as I have nothing that uses that OS. The implementation of the .NET APIs is a big step forward for developers though!
Thanks again for the insight.
Nathan Sheldon
http://www.nathansheldon.com/
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
KORG TRITON Studio V2 and KORG Trinity DRS have MIDI and Audio sequencers. 2 tracks on Triton Studio and 4 tracks on Trinity ... hard disk based audio recording. The aduio tracks can be routed to the onboard effects.
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live a musical life
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live a musical life
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
and yet the triton extreme didn't continue this.
Given that the Triton now seems to have come to the end of its life, perhaps the replacement will feature an even more capable audio section. Korg clearly have the technology - but will they make the marketing decision to keep a clear distance between their synth workstations and digitial recorders?
Loz
Given that the Triton now seems to have come to the end of its life, perhaps the replacement will feature an even more capable audio section. Korg clearly have the technology - but will they make the marketing decision to keep a clear distance between their synth workstations and digitial recorders?
Loz
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
The Triton - end of it's life?
No, that would be the Fantom-S.
bb
No, that would be the Fantom-S.
bb
Re: for you Loz(or anyone else!) (l:D)
yes, but not the Fantom series! (like the triton) from what I heard, Korg is movin on to the next big thing. Another thing is even though Korg had those 4 trax, It never convinced me of being an actual DAW but more like a sampler where you can sketch out idea's.
From what I hear, Yamaha's RS7000 & Motif have similar features, where you can use the midi trax as audio trax (great for geting a solid chorus & placing it wherever) but to me I still see it as a cool feature on a sampler, and hardly a DAW.
But fom messin around with the Fantom I kind of see that you could do almost the same thing with the sampler. I haven't tried it yet, but I think I saw someting where you can listen to the sequencer while your sampling(without sampling the sequencer) so I would guess to sing along to your song, and sample verses, chorus's etc. and place them where you see fit!(I think)
But I would definitely Like to see Roland, Yamaha, or korg come out with a 32 track synth(64 would be nice but I'm not greedy) so you can use 16 for music and 16 for vocals. With at least a 6 gig harddrive(again I'm not greedy,my 1880 has 6 and I'm happy), a small section for actual physical faders, Phantom pwr for your condensors, a mouse for EZ editing, and CD-RW to finsh the job, like Loz forcasted a few threads ago!
but that would mean $$$$$$$$$$
at least my dreams are free......till someone figures out how to harnas them and charge us for them with a monthly bill!!! HA!;D-
Septimo
From what I hear, Yamaha's RS7000 & Motif have similar features, where you can use the midi trax as audio trax (great for geting a solid chorus & placing it wherever) but to me I still see it as a cool feature on a sampler, and hardly a DAW.
But fom messin around with the Fantom I kind of see that you could do almost the same thing with the sampler. I haven't tried it yet, but I think I saw someting where you can listen to the sequencer while your sampling(without sampling the sequencer) so I would guess to sing along to your song, and sample verses, chorus's etc. and place them where you see fit!(I think)
But I would definitely Like to see Roland, Yamaha, or korg come out with a 32 track synth(64 would be nice but I'm not greedy) so you can use 16 for music and 16 for vocals. With at least a 6 gig harddrive(again I'm not greedy,my 1880 has 6 and I'm happy), a small section for actual physical faders, Phantom pwr for your condensors, a mouse for EZ editing, and CD-RW to finsh the job, like Loz forcasted a few threads ago!
but that would mean $$$$$$$$$$
at least my dreams are free......till someone figures out how to harnas them and charge us for them with a monthly bill!!! HA!;D-
Septimo