Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

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knolan
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Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by knolan »

I'm a huge fan of Integra-7 and will get one - but - the more I look at it, the more Roland confuse - namely - it looks like that are offering a stunning new technology in Motional Surround - and yet - you cannot record it to DAW audio tracks.

While they provide 6 analogue outputs to speakers, the manual shows Audio Out over USB to a computer is stereo only. Surely one will want to record motional surround audio out onto 6 DAW tracks too? And USB 2 can handle 40(+) tracks (as demonstrated by the Yamaha 01V96i).


So why has Roland gone to the bother of inventing the technology, providing 6 outputs to speakers, but no ability to record to DAW?


Surely they don't expect one to route the 6 audio analogue outputs into an Audio Interface to accomplish this when a USB cable with Audio is already supplied and they promote Integra-7 as an Audio interface too?

Am I missing something here on how this works?

Kevin.
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PauloF
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by PauloF »

knolan wrote:I'm a huge fan of Integra-7 and will get one - but - the more I look at it, the more Roland confuse - namely - it looks like that are offering a stunning new technology in Motional Surround - and yet - you cannot record it to DAW audio tracks.

While they provide 6 analogue outputs to speakers, the manual shows Audio Out over USB to a computer is stereo only. Surely one will want to record motional surround audio out onto 6 DAW tracks too? And USB 2 can handle 40(+) tracks (as demonstrated by the Yamaha 01V96i).


So why has Roland gone to the bother of inventing the technology, providing 6 outputs to speakers, but no ability to record to DAW?


Surely they don't expect one to route the 6 audio analogue outputs into an Audio Interface to accomplish this when a USB cable with Audio is already supplied and they promote Integra-7 as an Audio interface too?

Am I missing something here on how this works?

Kevin.
I don't think you are missing it no, unfortunately Audio over USB seems to be only a two channels (Stereo) both ways.
As you said, It seems that this was implemented to record the Motional Surround Audio only...awkward

The only way to record simultaneously several channels of Audio on a DAW would be to connect the 8 AUDIO OUTs to a USB/FW/Mixer and/or AUDIO/USB/Firewire Capture device in order to be able to record simultaneously up to 8 tracks of audio (provided the Motional Surround is OFF and there are different Parts assigned to those 8 OUTs).

i-7 works exactly like the V-Synth in this respect. Two channels of Audio only.

However you can record all the 16 parts as MIDI and reproduce them through the i-7... but that is not Audio Recording... ;-)
JunoJohn
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by JunoJohn »

PauloF wrote:The only way to record simultaneously several channels of Audio on a DAW would be to connect the 8 AUDIO OUTs to a USB/FW/Mixer and/or AUDIO/USB/Firewire Capture device…
Maybe that's why Roland advertised the Integra-7 along with an Octa-Capture?
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-fG0brAexd2M/U ... uipter.jpg
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PauloF
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by PauloF »

JunoJohn wrote:
PauloF wrote:The only way to record simultaneously several channels of Audio on a DAW would be to connect the 8 AUDIO OUTs to a USB/FW/Mixer and/or AUDIO/USB/Firewire Capture device…
Maybe that's why Roland advertised the Integra-7 along with an Octa-Capture?
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-fG0brAexd2M/U ... uipter.jpg
Maybe, yes :-)
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by JunoJohn »

Let's see. That's…

$2000 for the Integra-7

add $500(?) for the iPad to control it

add $600 for the Octa-Capture to record it

subtract $78 for the Small Stone phaser I don't need to buy ;-)
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PauloF
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by PauloF »

JunoJohn wrote:Let's see. That's…

$2000 for the Integra-7

add $500(?) for the iPad to control it

add $600 for the Octa-Capture to record it

subtract $78 for the Small Stone phaser I don't need to buy ;-)
$2000 for the Integra-7 Right !

add $500(?) for the iPad to control it No need, I have one already ;-D

add $600 for the Octa-Capture to record it No need, I have a Audio Capture device already ;-D
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SoundworldA.D.
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by SoundworldA.D. »

$2000 for the Integra-7: No, $1999 PLUS TAX =$2163.92 USD

add $500(?) for the iPad to control it: Well yes, I have no I-Pad Is there a certain model that I need to get? Doogie don't know nothin' about no ding-danged I-Pads!

add $600 for the Octa-Capture to record it: No need, I will dump straight to a 32-channel mixer so's I can mix da soundz along with the OASYS, Jupiter-80 and V-Synth's

I know...the Soundworld is behind the techno times but the Soundworld's needs are simple...TURN ON...START JAMMING! ;-(|)
knolan
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by knolan »

Actually - having watched the Sonicstate review of the Integra 7, I now realise that the 8 outputs on the back of the Integra-7 can also act as 8 individual outs.

Yet - as flagged in the the title of this thread, one cannot route 8 output streams to USB and into a DAW.


Now I have to say, in a "prosessional" setup in the way Roland are promoting this module - as a sound source for TV / Film - there is absolutely no way that one would use just Stereo Out. It will nearly always be the case that one will want to route individual instruments to individual tracks for separate mixing/treatment.


So even more, I am flabargasted that Roland would go to the bother of creating such a vastly capable instrument in terms of sound engines, libraries, arrangements of 16 intruments, 5.1 motional control - and even go to the bother of offering audio over USB (albeit only stereo) - when the USB line is capable of 40+ Audio streams - and then not bother to offer the 8 audio channels from the Integra via USB to Computer / DAW. I don't get it. It's only a software routing - the 8 audio streams are already there, going to the D/A converters for the analogue outs! It's a driver issue, that's it.


There really is some sort of either twisted logic going on in Roland, or else utter naivity and unprofessional "awareness" by some of their top decision makers.

A message to Roland - your FIRST port of call for any update, should you want this module to be used by media composers - is to offer 8 (if not 16) outs over USB to Computer. It's an absolute necessity, or you can forget that market.


Kevin.
Devnor
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by Devnor »

It's a driver issue
Yep. Its a significant expense to develop drivers for all platforms & keep them up to date. There is another expense supporting users with a wide variety of hardware, OS and DAW versions. Folks are already complaining because the editor doesn't run on their host of choice. The reality is fewer than 5% of users would be streaming 16 parts from Integra. Why? They would run out of polyphony and users are demanding sounds with massive layers. Remember those folks saying 30 osc per key on Jupiter isn't enough?

A $500 Focusrite 8ch mic pre with ADAT outputs to your interface is the solution.
knolan
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by knolan »

Devnor wrote:
It's a driver issue
Yep. Its a significant expense to develop drivers for all platforms & keep them up to date. There is another expense supporting users with a wide variety of hardware, OS and DAW versions. Folks are already complaining because the editor doesn't run on their host of choice. The reality is fewer than 5% of users would be streaming 16 parts from Integra. Why? They would run out of polyphony and users are demanding sounds with massive layers. Remember those folks saying 30 osc per key on Jupiter isn't enough?

A $500 Focusrite 8ch mic pre with ADAT outputs to your interface is the solution.
But it's all already in place - and they have already written the drivers! All of the substantive work is done - 2 channels - 8 channels - these days that's a 'nothing' of a difference. They've already done all the hard work. The drivers already exist for 2 channels, juat improve it to 8 (again, a trivial task these days).

Sorry - I don't accept your reasonong - and I can tell you- this module, in particular, is being targeted as an altenative to the sample library / soft synth market 'cause it's a module and it's mentioned in all of their blurb and videos - but again I can assure you - separate instruments need separate treatment in the mix and without that capability this module will be simply ignored by media composers because it's not worth the hassle.

Kevin.
Dany
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by Dany »

-
Kevin, as you should know, the self-imposed restrictions on their products have just one single reason:

Roland Corp. want you to buy their hardware!

Image
;)
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PauloF
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by PauloF »

Dany wrote:-
Kevin, as you should know, the self-imposed restrictions on their products have just one single reason:

Roland Corp. want you to buy their hardware!

Image
;)
Fully agree, exactly what I said on another Thread
Roland wants us to buy their hardware. PERIOD
knolan
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by knolan »

Look, lets get into the real world here. Busy composers don't give a rats arse about Roland audio interfaces and will not shift their strategically managed composing environment and work flow to accommodate a Roland interface for the sake of integrating an Integra-7. There are far too many synth engines and sample libraries in software only, supremely managed from a DAW environment, to bother with that nonsense.

For any one who has spent a lot of time getting their environment right, and busy now with the next looming deadline, I can promise you, Integra-7 will not get a look in - and will not get within a country mile of any such studio setup, unless it is easily integrated into a capable multitrack DAW setup - very easily.

So if there is some dumb wit in Roland who does not get that, they need to be fired. And it Roland are stupid enough to think that Integra-7's are going to help sell audio interfaces, then they need their heads examined.

Look, I'm a huge synth hardware fan and user, but I'm also busy with keeping a computer DAW environment managed and with composing. I surely want an Integra-7, but I feel as if Roland are acting the maggot by releasing, in 2012, a 16-part module, go to the bother of giving 8 analogue outs (FAR more costly that what I'm talking about by the way), go to the bother of putting USB-audio on the thing, go to the bother of writing an audio driver for PC and Mac, but decide to only offer stereo over the USB(!). This thing needs 8, if not 16, audio channels over USB.
Devnor
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by Devnor »

Kevin, lets tone down the rhetoric and immature name calling. That does not bode well for your professional assertions. Roland Corp is far from stupid.

Hey if i7 doesnt work for you, there are other options. If you expect multichannel audio streams from a synth, then you probably aren't happy with anything and should just buy a Kronos or Motif. Like I just suggested, a 8 channel audio device with ADAT output is probably the solution. My Focusrite Octopre has ADAT outputs to the interface and accepts masterclock. Sounds excellent and no drivers required.
epu
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Re: Integra-7 USB Audio - Stereo only?

Post by epu »

Waste of money! Roland is keeping everyone proprietary. I'm so glad I stopped drinking the Roland Tang years ago.

That said I still have a soft spot for Roland. I wish they would wake up and make their boxes more integrated with MODERN TECHNOLOGY. Even at a High Price they would push far more units!
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