Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

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Emmerson
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Joined: 21:57, 13 August 2014

Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by Emmerson »

I am trying to use the transpose so I can trigger a sound from the Drums. I want to move a sound effect from the top end of the keyboard to the bottom end but the Transpose doesn't move the Drums. Is this possible ? The sound effect works in the Ch10 Drum setup for a standard kit and others but just doesn't move if I try to transpose it.
bennyseven
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Location: Germany

Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by bennyseven »

I think the TONE must be transposed (and written to new memory location), not the part. Did you try this?
Emmerson
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Joined: 21:57, 13 August 2014

Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by Emmerson »

Not sure what you mean. I have a SN drum kit selected Ch10 and need to transpose a sound on key G6 so I can trigger it with my left hand. I am using multi channel layered sounds in a studio set.
bennyseven
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Location: Germany

Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by bennyseven »

I mean you can not change the assigned key of a drum intrument in the studio set.
Only way is to try to get the right drum sound to the key with the transpose options of the drum part.

If you have no success, you better creat a new drum kit.
All related parameter from the edit menu could be found in the Parameter Manual, page 38.

Best way is to create a new SN Drum kit, where your drum instrument is assigned to a key of your choice (this key is called PARTIAL). Partials can only the keys Eb1 to E6. Drum kits may contain from one upt to 62 drum instruments.

So if you want your drum sound on key G6, best way is to assign to partial key G5 and the transpose your keyboard on octave.
scramble
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Joined: 20:21, 16 November 2007

Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by scramble »

You can't use the Pitch function in Part View to transpose the sounds in a drum kit like you can with, for example, a piano sound. With a piano patch, when you change pitch all you're doing is changing the 'key mapping'. For instance, suppose you transpose your piano part up 4 semitones. Then if you play key C2 all that happens, in effect, is that key E2 is triggered instead of C2, so the sample assigned to E2 gets triggered.

But it's completely different for drum parts. When you use the Pitch function to transpose a drum sound then all that happens is that the sound engine literally 'repitches' that same sample in real time. So, for example, if you have a drum part, with a drum kit loaded, and there's a bongo sound mapped/assigned to key E3, and you change pitch by +3 on that part, then pressing E3 again doesn't play whatever sound is assigned to G3 instead, it still plays the sound assigned to E3, ie. the bongo sound, but raises it in pitch by 3 semitones. Try it out for yourself. This is obviously a useful feature for some people, but rather annoying for people like the OP, and me, who just want to trigger percussion sounds with different keys.

What I do is just find the waveform for the drum or percussion sound I want and then make a new tone using that waveform. Start with a basic tone like a piano tone that doesn't have lots of weird settings and FX on it. Don't save it in the Drum or Percussion category, save it as something else, eg. SFX or Hit. Then you can use the Pitch function to transpose it, so you can play it with the bottom key with your left hand, but transposed up a few octaves so it is at the pitch you want. (Obviously, you want to set the range of that part so only the bottom key is active.)

I've done this for handclaps and finger snaps, which I need to use sometimes.

Alternatively you could create a new drumkit, but I've never done it that way. I like having it as a Tone because then it's easy to find in the SFX or Hit category, which don't have a lot of entries. (I use obvious names.)
Emmerson
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Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by Emmerson »

Many thanks for the information.
scramble
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Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by scramble »

I always find it annoying when a keyboard doesn't have dedicated tones for things like handclaps, finger snaps and gongs. I guess they figure that you can load a drum kit for those, but that's a pain, and sometimes has the key-mapping limitations I've just gone through.

You'd think GM would have those sounds, you have all sorts of SFX and percussion sounds in there (woodblocks, castanets, horse gallop, trains, whistles), but not the ones I actually use as a keyboard player. At least GM has a reverse cymbal sound, which I occasionally use.
Skijumptoes
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Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by Skijumptoes »

FA does have tones for stuff like that doesn't it? Unless one of the SRX expansions has provided it to me, i'm sure of got loads of such samples that i can select, including drum loops/break beats etc.

My FA is boxed up at the moment as i'm having a sort out in my music room, so can't check argh!
scramble
Posts: 88
Joined: 20:21, 16 November 2007

Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by scramble »

>FA does have tones for stuff like that doesn't it?

No it doesn't! Waveforms, yes. Tones, no. Have a look through the FA sound list if you don't believe me:
FA sound list pdf

>Unless one of the SRX expansions has provided it to me

There are no claps, snaps or gong tones on the SRX cards I've used, other than one gong patch called 'Tam Tam' on the Orchestra card, and I've been through most of them over the years. Anyway, who wants to take up one of the two SRX slots on an FA just for a handclap tone?
Skijumptoes
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Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by Skijumptoes »

As it has waveforms, you can just create a tone from that, surely?

Besides, i remember seeing a Clap 1/Clap 2 menu preset when scrolling through, and they contained 8-12 tones within each spread across different keys, and a whole medley of bass drum/snare drum/hats/percussion menu presets too.

I've created numerous breakbeats from these 'menu' presets using studio sets into the sequencer and then sampling them into a pad as a loop.

I've probably completely missed the point you're making, but unless my minds gone crazy, i'm sure there's plenty of claps on offer. And there's certainly plenty of scope on using studio sets to build up beats that can be sampled in to other projects.
scramble
Posts: 88
Joined: 20:21, 16 November 2007

Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by scramble »

Skijumptoes wrote:As it has waveforms, you can just create a tone from that, surely?
Er... did you even read my initial reply? The one where I explained to the OP that he should make a Tone from the waveform? :)
Skijumptoes wrote:Besides, i remember seeing a Clap 1/Clap 2 menu preset when scrolling through, and they contained 8-12 tones within each spread across different keys, and a whole medley of bass drum/snare drum/hats/percussion menu presets too.
There is nothing like this on the FA-06/08. (If there is I would like to know!)
Skijumptoes wrote:I've probably completely missed the point you're making, but unless my minds gone crazy, i'm sure there's plenty of claps on offer.
Waveforms/samples, yes. Within drum kits, yes. Tones/patches, no.
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Lunar
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Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by Lunar »

Skijumptoes wrote:Besides, i remember seeing a Clap 1/Clap 2 menu preset when scrolling through, and they contained 8-12 tones within each spread across different keys, and a whole medley of bass drum/snare drum/hats/percussion menu presets too.


There is nothing like this on the FA-06/08. (If there is I would like to know!)


Some of those tones are part of an Integra SN-S expansion, either NYC Nightlife or Sounds of Summer I think. There are also a ton of clap, snare & kick menus etc. as part of EXP-01 Dance Trax that are ready to go without any editing.

Sorry about not quoting properly, for some reason it's messed up....
Skijumptoes
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Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by Skijumptoes »

Lunar - thanks, that would tie up as i definitely have some of the integra tones from the Axial site, and also have EXP-01 on there as i was looking for as many Juno 106/60/6 sounds, and 90's rave sounds when i first got my FA to see what it's capable of - so you're probably spot on, and they've been on there since day one almost.

Sorry Scramble, but presumed they were just part of the base presets.
scramble
Posts: 88
Joined: 20:21, 16 November 2007

Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by scramble »

Just had a look, and yes, the 'Clap' menu is on EXP-01 Dance Trax.

But as I said, it would make more sense to just create a clap tone from the existing in-built clap waveforms, rather than take up a whole EXP slot for that.
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piaknowguy
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Re: Using Transpose to relocate a Drum sound

Post by piaknowguy »

Re-sample it.
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