What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

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stevel
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Joined: 07:08, 17 May 2015

What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by stevel »

I think I figured out one time out the source and destination things worked for controlling MFX parameters or something, but now I these are different and I've never figured out what they do or where they apply to...

Help?
lipi
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Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by lipi »

For eg.:
You use a phaser as MFX.
On MFX Control tab:
Control source 1 is set to CC1 (modwheel).
Destination set to Rate.
Sens set to +64

The result is when you will push the modwheel, your phaser rate will incrasing.

Details: Parameter manual page:67, and the "#" marked parameters on FX's from page 94 and following...
stevel
Posts: 520
Joined: 07:08, 17 May 2015

Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by stevel »

Thanks lipi, I'll try this this afternoon.

But actually I think the "Tone Control Source" (just realized my typo in the title!) is something altogether different.
Xanadu1209
Posts: 35
Joined: 20:22, 10 January 2018

Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by Xanadu1209 »

I wasn't sure what this is for either but I finally did some reading. The manual isn't great at explaining this. It looks like you set a tone control to a MIDI CC and then you can use that tone control as a source in the mod matrix. Instead of having specific CC's set in the matrix, this would allow you to have a tone set up with a matrix that can respond to different CC's depending on the studio set you're using it in. MFX Control can also accept these as a source.

Tone control is also tied to system control (under the system setup). You can have the four system controls as global parameters for the whole keyboard or have tone controls set in each studio set.

It appears that some of the SuperNATURAL Acousic sounds are affected by System Control as well, but I'm not sure how this works yet.

I hope this makes sense. There could also be another purpose for this feature that I'm not aware of. There are definitely certain parts of the manual that are quite lacking.
stevel
Posts: 520
Joined: 07:08, 17 May 2015

Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by stevel »

Ahh, see I think you're on to something.

This may be how they get the additional CC#s on Supernatural sounds to do the things like the variations on the SN Strings sounds...

They are listed in the Implementation chart as "Tone Modify" and "Tone Variation" and the CC#s correspond to the General Purpose controller numbers that affect the Supernatural sounds.

System Control 1 and 2 are Mod and Aftertouch.

So this all kind of makes sense.

Not sure what you could do with it though.

It sounds like Pizzicato might be already controlled by CC81 or whatever, and you could just make the Tone Control 2 (or whichever it is) be triggered by CC 5 instead.

Hmmm....
stevel
Posts: 520
Joined: 07:08, 17 May 2015

Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by stevel »

OK I just fiddled with this a bit and here's what I think I've discovered:

I pulled up the first SN Strings patch.

By default, Dynamics+Vibrato are tied to the Mod lever and CC01, while Aftertouch is tied to the Level.

These are System Control 1 and 2 respectively.

Now, the Tone Control is set to Mod, Aftertouch, Breath, And Foot Type.

What I can do is change Tone Control Source 1 from CC01 to CC whatever (I think 3 is the first empty one).

Then I can assign CC03 to the first Matrix Knob.

Now I can control the Dynamics and Vibrato with that Knob, rather than the Mod Wheel.

And also, the Mod Wheel no longer does anything.

Here's what I'm beginning to think:

Tone Control 3 is by default set to Breath. I'm betting that's for Supernatural Brass or Wind sounds that you might control with an Aerophone or similar type controller and that those do certain things on those SN sounds that maybe only Integra owners have access to.

"Foot Type" is a mysterious CC message that I've never been able to find any information on.

But it appears that maybe the only purpose of the Tone Control Source knobs is to re-assign them to some other control and maybe possibly use that control for something else.

This might be useful for a layered sound when you still want both of the modifications, but want them on different controls - for example, the mod on Part 2 could act like it normally does, but it "disconnected" on Part 1 which you would use the knob for instead.

God I would have rather had MFX on/off assignable...
lipi
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Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by lipi »

I'm sorry stevel, I'm a bit misunderstood you here: viewtopic.php?f=55&t=54627&p=306482#p306473
stevel wrote:But it appears that maybe the only purpose of the Tone Control Source knobs is to re-assign them to some other control and maybe possibly use that control for something else.

This might be useful for a layered sound when you still want both of the modifications, but want them on different controls - for example, the mod on Part 2 could act like it normally does, but it "disconnected" on Part 1 which you would use the knob for instead.
You're right. I got the same thing.
stevel wrote: God I would have rather had MFX on/off assignable...
Or at least a "MIDI sysex assign to PAD1-16" function ... ;)
kanthos
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Joined: 17:48, 6 February 2018

Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by kanthos »

stevel wrote:"Foot Type" is a mysterious CC message that I've never been able to find any information on.
I'm not at my keyboard right now so I can't check this, but by Foot Type, do you mean CC #4? That's a standard MIDI control for an expression-type pedal (but separate from MIDI CC #11, Expression). Some keyboards, including the FA series, let you use two separate expression pedals, and CC #11 and CC #4 tend to be the default CCs. My Nord Stage, for example, lets me use one pedal for expression (so I can control various assignable things, like crossfading between two sounds), and one for swell on a B3 organ (which is tonally different from just being volume; the expression pedal could do the volume bit just fine). The assignments are CC #11 and CC #4.
stevel
Posts: 520
Joined: 07:08, 17 May 2015

Re: What does the Tone Control Souce 1-4 do?

Post by stevel »

Thanks Kanthos - that's more information that I've ever heard on it!
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